Hi,
regarding latest patch:
Lute does not provide castspeed and Guitar does not provide physical attack speed.
I tested with mystical Instruments
Kind regards
Posts by xLutinex
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Lute and Guitar changes -> 1000 👍👍👍
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Answer is easy: not worth it. We had a tank with plate gear, he sold plate, bought chain dps gear and he had better aggro, better dmg, more deff and for him better gameplay than in plate gear.
Champion should need new gear (not dps) to tank, but if he dont need, r/k shouldn't need too. If r/k will not be tank then he should be good dps like any rogue, in this moment r/k is crap class.
That is my observation.
sadly yes. The only reason needing a knight would be tanking rofl endboss with 20 stacks of buff or more (without possibility to kite, which is a joke in my eyes). I don't really know if a champ is able to tank it with 20 stacks but i doubt it
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Personally I am totally against skills mixing roles with just 1 gear. That's why I also don't want r/k to have full tank ability with full dps gear.
R/k is an offtank in my eyes who can definitly tank a boss for a short time without problems
Sadly I cannot say something about dps. Need to test it soon.
I want to mention that full knight tanks cannot switch to dps with 1 skill;) so please let the tank role at classes with full tank equip
Kind regards
"I want to mention that full knight tanks cannot switch to dps with 1 skill;)"
Yea, but champion can
I agree with you about mixing roles, but if champion can be better tank than knight in dps gear, can heal in dps gear. So why r/k cant tank? Champion dont must create new gear (for example 3x sta/sta + 3x str/str) so why r/k must create new gear. But okey, what if i will have new gear only for r/k? Class will be weaker tank than champion and knight. Still less amount of deff, zero dodges, zero evaporation, cant use shield of discipline. I want see on tank only knight, but if champion can tank in dps gear, let r/k tank in dps gear or forbid this on champion too.
Idea with offtank is not nice for me because we dont need offtank anywhere in this moment. So if we are against mixing roles lets change r/k in only dps, that will be nice too. About mixing gear, in my gear on k/r and on r/k (full tank tranformation) i can do the same dps
In my opinion in this moment tank skills on r/k are totally crap with zero utility, so we should improve this skills or remove and upgrade dps possibilities. I dont know anybody who want play on r/k, propably because he is the weakest dps (about rogues) and the weakest tank, r/p is better
Kind regards
The Champ is a separate topic. But you should ask your own: what shall all main knight tanks do,if every class can tank. Why doing plate Gear?
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Hey,
in my observation, r/k is really bad dps in this moment and he is crap tank.
About dps i will be silent because r/k should be tank in my opinion. I have ultimate t13 gear (4-2 dex-str), i cant tank rofl and inferno. I have jewellery set, raksha dagger and wings with stats:
Sta/sta rofl, gorge, inferno and Sta/dex rofl, gorge, inferno.
With this and with reduction from p/d i can tank inferno. Rofl with sigils is impossible, maybe if i will have full dex/dex gear or sta/sta + sta/dex i will can this but that will be crap gear only for r/k. For example champion can tank in full dps gear. Rogue dps gear is 4-2 or 3-3. R/k have small amount of deff, zero dodge, zero evaporation, have only one reduction (35% duration: 10 sec cd: 2 min). Additionally he is only combination with knight which cant use shield of discipline (s/k cant use too).
My propositions about r/k:
1) let him do dmg without tank trasformation
2) let him use weaker form shields of discipline without shield or let him use shield
3) increase duration of Holy Light Protection or reduce CD
4) maybe sth like on k/r - healing from dodges (but he dont have dodges
)5) Permanent reduction dmg - 20%
I dont need all changes, that are only my propositions about what we can do to upgrade r/k gameplay and utility. That is only my experience.
Best regards and invite to the discussion
Personally I am totally against skills mixing roles with just 1 gear. That's why I also don't want r/k to have full tank ability with full dps gear.
R/k is an offtank in my eyes who can definitly tank a boss for a short time without problems
Sadly I cannot say something about dps. Need to test it soon.
I want to mention that full knight tanks cannot switch to dps with 1 skill;) so please let the tank role at classes with full tank equip
Kind regards
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Hi,
regarding Knight/CHamp:
I found out why the aggro is so insane.
Blessed Hammer passive with 45% hammer damage is a bit buggy.
See tooltip in skillbook and when you post the skill ->
For example here are Knight/CH without EQ
With sword:
And here with hammer:
The hammer damage is increasing by more than 80% instead of only 45%.
Guess it is a bug and should be 45%? The skill is +104 if I post it and in skill book it is capped at 55.
Can a dev clarify it if the tooltip in skillbook is wrong or the damage increase?Kind regards
*Edit* edited the +104 and +55 difference
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Regarding Knight/Champ:
Electrocution Chain is a bit to strong. Resetting several seconds of cooldown within the next 10 seconds result in perma stunning within big pulls. Today I could use it 3 times within 1 big trashpull after b2 and within the big pull after b3.
I would suggest to remove the CD reset function of this skill.
Second is the every 3 second shock strike with massive aggro. I played with sword, not best weapon for this class, and the aggro generated with shock strike was more than with every other class. But the upcoming patch should balance it in my opinion
Btw: Thank you @dev team for all the good job in balancing process
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"The Knight currently has no aggro problems."
Indeed. That's why K/Ch will be fine, even with 6 sec cd on Shock Strike.
"The entire point is that aggro should not be changed otherwise there will be issues."
Not a single Knight combination has to rely on secondary-class specific skills to build and hold aggro. The default Knight skills are more than enough.
The Shock strike will still be on a 3 second cooldown, if the general changes are consistant. The problem is that one must use their aggro skills to keep the aggro. Electrocution chain is a GCD that does not generate extra aggro. In that time you must catch up to the other players aggro. Consistency is key in farming in end-game scenarios. And if aggro is such a non-issue, why should one nerf it? The entire point makes absolutely no sense. It comes across as a knee-jerk reaction over points that aren't even sensible.
QuoteChampion
- Reduced Shock Strike cooldown to 3 seconds from 6 seconds, reduced aggro modifier with Shield Form to 500% from 1000%, same target won’t get stunned again after 3 seconds of first stun, but still will be interrupted.
Knight/Champion
- Changed Mighty Strike to do not reduce cooldown of Shock Strike anymore.
Because nobody wanted to report tanks. Because in 99% player are reporting to OP dps
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Again. Even Zyrex said that EVERY TANK has no aggro problems. wo WHY is that a PROBLEM nerfing the shock strike aggro multiplier?
Whirlwind SHield with an aggro multi of 1000% is nearly enough to be afk after 1 WS in a single trash group.
I tried every tank combination. really every. every class can hold aggro but K/R and K/Ch are kinda a joke in aggro as it is now
Because the K/Ch is balanced around it's Electrocution Chain, a skill that provides no aggro multi. You are not able to hold aggro after pulling without an AoE. Whirlwind shield is not enough for aggro if you have high area damage classes. That is the entire issue.
Taking down those multis makes the CC borderline useless. Come on. It's not a hard concept to grasp.Tell me? How can tanks like K/M, K/P, K/S and K/D can hold aggro in such situations only with their whirlwind shield?
It's not a hard concept to grasp.
No offense.
And btw as K/CH the whirlwind shield is doing 45% more aggro then from K/M, K/P and K/D, because K/CH has a 45% damage passive, which improves all skills. In summary the ability of K/CH and the massive aggro output is like the K/R. both are totally OP in my opinion as a long year playing tank
Edit:
Not a single Knight combination has to rely on secondary-class specific skills to build and hold aggro. The default Knight skills (and iss) are more than enough.
Yes!!! That's my point, so the aggro of Shock Strike doen't affect the overall aggro, but it's CC utility is the core mechanic of this class, but has to stay on 3s to enable this ability of CC how it is. The aggro of Shock Strike does only matter, if you use it in specific situations, but then it does.
The 3 sec CD will be stayed at 3 seconds, because every /ch got 3 sec now
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Again. Even Zyrex said that EVERY TANK has no aggro problems. wo WHY is that a PROBLEM nerfing the shock strike aggro multiplier?
Whirlwind SHield with an aggro multi of 1000% is nearly enough to be afk after 1 WS in a single trash group.
I tried every tank combination. really every. every class can hold aggro but K/R and K/Ch are kinda a joke in aggro as it is now
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And yes, shock strike, a nearly spammable 1000% aggro multiplier skill hmmm.... the reduce to 500% is also not noticable as a K/CH, because you have the highest damage passive of all knights. So please don't say something about aggro. The one knight which is having aggro "problems" is the K/P, because reducing aggro of raidmembers in 2021 is kinda useless, if all are at 10% without this skill
"So please don't say something about aggro." Not a very nice way to discuss something. Don't tell people what to say and what not to say unless you want to come across as arrogant and condescending.
The K/Chs whole thing is that he controls monsters. That's it. He needs a good aggro skill since one of his main mechanics, electrocution chain, does not generate any. It's cooldown resets when monsters die, hence removing the need to use it again. The whole argument "you can use it multiple times" is invalid simply because moving dead monsters is frankly useless. A low cooldown hit is absolutely vital to the integrity of the class and whirling shield just does not cut it alone.
If there is any Knight being broken right now it's K/R. Seriously. There's a reason every meta chaser plays that class: Incredibly low skill ceiling, two aggro areas, free crit, extra def and sustaining oneself. Also the attack speed passive, nimble hands, grants a nice boost passive boost to ones aggro, since all aggro skills are based on DPS, not flat damage. Sure it's not as high as the K/Chs, but it's something.
It's seems like you can't see the absolute value of classes because you haven't properly played them yet, but that's just my two cents.I fully agree on K/P though. Class could use an update to make it more relevant.
Sure I am arrogant, because I can
The "problem" in my eyes is the contradiction. First saying to not reduce aggro multi
2) Will the aggro multiplier of Shok Strike for K/Ch also be reduced? In that case please don't, this skill deals the perfect amount of aggro to use it on range in our runs, reducing it would make it kinda useless in my eyes
and then saying no knight have aggro issues
However, talking about knight tank balancing seems to be a waste of time imho, because as mentioned, you can even play without any sec class to hold aggro, it doesn't matter if you have 100kk aggro after burst or 150kk.
And the whole thing is only about the aggro Oo. Because the next patch will reduce shock strike CD to 3 sec for all classes. So what is the problem to reduce the aggro multiplier to 500%?
And yes, I played the K/Ch. Some mechanics can be kinda broken in some situations.
Regarding the K/R. He is strong yes, but has definitly not the best aggro. it is at rank 3 or 4.
And btw I know the values of the classes, maybe more than almost every other player, because I test things in detail.
Ontopic: Even 500% 3 sec aggro AOE is one of the strongest a knight have. And yes, only whirling shield + ISS is enough for every tank, because you can hold the aggro in rofl without any secondary class which means, that it is easier on harder content to do more aggro than dps classes comparing the damage the tank and dps dealing in rofl and new content
Kind regards
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Originally I was considering to suggest an increase of Shock Strikes CD on Knight/Champ as well to 6sec, as it normally is/was.
I play K/Ch only, since 1 week after it came out. I think talking about aggro potential as a knight is useless since all knight combos can hold aggro without any problem. So it's just a matter of utility and K/Ch has a lot of this, which is the core functionality of this class.
You don't just tank and do your own stuff, but you support your entire raid by a huge CC mechanic. The stacking, stunning, interrupting mechanics make this class unique, also the 3s are required for some specific parts in rofl. Increasing the cd would fail the purpose of the class imo. It's not that tanky as others and you always need to keep your stacks at 10 not to loose your def. Also the cone AoE requires some movement on many situation, even in our greater pulls.However, talking about knight tank balancing seems to be a waste of time imho, because as mentioned, you can even play without any sec class to hold aggro, it doesn't matter if you have 100kk aggro after burst or 150kk. And every tank subclass has its own playstyle, that's why I'm playing this class and not a Ch/K. And if it comes to the topic which knight subclasses are too strong, the K/Ch wouldn't be on the first 2 or 3 places (but that could be a discussion for itself I guess).
Also seeing few tanks not playing K/R is a good thing in my opinion 
Just one point of view of myself.
K/Ch has the ability the nearly stun all mobs in every trash group, even in massive pulls. The most dangerous for other classes than the tank can be the big pulls, where many mobs can use any AOE and kills the players. K/CH can stun all of them, pull them together and reset his cooldown while the mobs are killed Oo. If I think about our 2-3 dps runs, the 2 seconds stun is nearly enough to kill every mob of big pulls Oo -> resetting CD of AOE stun/pull instantl.
If I compare this mechanic to the Ch/Wl, it is kinda OP because the CH/Wl cannot reset his CD
And yes, shock strike, a nearly spammable 1000% aggro multiplier skill hmmm.... the reduce to 500% is also not noticable as a K/CH, because you have the highest damage passive of all knights. So please don't say something about aggro. The one knight which is having aggro "problems" is the K/P, because reducing aggro of raidmembers in 2021 is kinda useless, if all are at 10% without this skill
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The problem of "Holy Thunder Blade" (Lv 98 ISS)
There is also the Lv 98 Holy Thunder Blade, which does a Non-Aggro hit but increases your total aggro by 5%. Through the fact that your Holy Strike deals (more or less) equal damage but has an aggro multiplier, the 5% only matter if your total aggro is about 100kk or more. Only then this skill is better than Holy Strike if it comes to aggro only. But Holy Strike additionally puts Holy Seal on the target, which is required for several skills, so the Holy Thunder Blade (and also the Lv 75 Myrmex Sickle) is just useless in my eyes
Hi,
this ISS is a taunt btw. So it is not as useless as you think
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Hi,
overall the post is good, but there are some points which are questionable.
In either way you should choose the highest possible stats you can get and effort. I would also recomment to use a Light elemtal Pet or magical Aurora (for additional wisdom). The more wisdom you have, the more is regenerated by Holy Power Explosion. But also a physical Aurora is possible for some more HP through the strength attribute.
Why additional wisdom? Wisdom for a knight is like dex. You don't need it. You will only regenerate more mana with more wisdom by Holy Power Explosion, because it will regenerate 3% mana. But the main mana regeneration will come from healers which are healing you while you have Holy Power Explosion active.
Furthermore this
I would recommend 2 different builds: Max-HP and Average.
Max-HP build takes 5 Protector (Sta/Sta/HP/Def) and 1 red Keeper (Sta/HP). If possible, use 6 Protectors. (but at this moment there are only 5 available)
Average build takes 4 Protector and 2 Endurance (Sta/Str/Patt/Def).
contradicts to this
Using a High-Patt-Build is nonsense in my opinion. No tank needs Patt to do its job right. It might be much easier but one day you come to a point to decide if you want to stand bosses or die because of too low defense. I saw tanks working with High-Patt but they always had been on a risk. And as a tank I do not take any risks. I would recommend not to go for a High-Patt build but the Average build with 2 Endurance stats is still okay.
Having 2 Endurance on each item on your full gear with the runes you listed is waste if you do this for the physical attack on the Endurance. The physical attack is still so low (I am only speaking for highest instances. On lower instances it might be pushing your aggro), that your aggro is the same like with full protector build.
Kind regards
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But don't forget r/d supports with permanent -10% def reduce for pdps and mdps. I will test r/d soon again
I tested r/d now and I don't know. Little bit weaker than r/wrd in fullburst but AOE burst and AOE sustain is way stronger. Furthermore you can reduce 10% def of every mob. In my eyes the class is overall a little bit to strong compared for example with r/ch (a lot of group support, which you don't have on the group at every trash group and r/ch has also weaker aoe).
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But don't forget r/d supports with permanent -10% def reduce for pdps and mdps. I will test r/d soon again
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Hi,
I also tested rogue/warrior after the last patch now. I didn't played this class for a long time and never saw a rogue/warrior doing more damage than my rogue/warden.
I need to say: this class is still kinda to strong. I would suggest to reduce the damage over time damage from the skill ID 499476 and increase the CD of whirlwind (ID 499481) to 2 seconds (or reduce damage of it significantly).
I also need to say I was solo rogue and I only can image what damage this class will do with rogues that make bleedings for me. (Nayat bursted with 70kk+ dps and did 538kk damage -> without wound attack Oo)
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Warden/Mage
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Changed Spiritual Feedback to provide 24% physical damage instead of 30% physical attack.
who will give me back my diamonds and setskill from the golden equipment?
Let me tell you:
Greetings,
...It is suggested that you do not make any irrational decisions pertaining to your own equipment items as a result of this patch.
Keep in mind that this is the beta stage of class balancing and testing on the live server.
You can expect changes based on our observations and feedback provided from the community over the next month.
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Changed Spiritual Feedback to provide 24% physical damage instead of 30% physical attack.
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After seeing you are planning to make rofl harder, doing tons of nerfs in next patch... What about implementing hell rofl mode instead? Making harder ini with same loot 8 months after instance is out isn't fair for those guilds without golden gear I think. If you want more challenge make a new mode with extra loot so strong guilds can have fun and those in the process don't quit. Server finally have good amount of people, I wouldn't want them to leave.
- Added physical attack, attack speed and bad luck aura to Nayat, Siddartha and Krishna in Realm of Forgotten Legends Hard Mode.
I really hope this bad luck thing isn't about boxes rng because is already a disaster. We spent 22 minutes the other day to do the freaking event cose most boxes appear outside the room or never match our buffs.
totally agree!!!!
I have a few ideas for such a hell mode xd like last boss starts with 10 stacks, has minimum 2 add phases and get move speed, that you cannot kite it to avoid damage 😍
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Good to see changes on RoFL! Hope it will increase total difficulty of the instance!
1 boss - can you tell us some more details about those auras? The auras are from the beginning of tactic or bosses gets one of them if someone will fail?
Also im not sure if it was asked, but could you try fix that sometimes tank gets aggro on guardians, even if he wont use any dmg skills/taunt on them? I know that tanking it with 0 deff now is possible but not sure what will happen with those auras
2 boss - more vigilance on boss, good change. But if u want to implement it, i hope u will fix those "lags" in spawning of the small circles. Even now its annoying
3 boss - yay, finally 80% of the party wont be afk during the fight
I think you could also add some more hp/deff to mobs there to not burst them instantly.4 boss - check for heals, atleast those high number of wis will be helpful !
5 boss - maybe also more hp/deff there could be added to boss? Not sure about it and feelings from other guilds, but more tactics would definitely increase difficulty of boss. Atleast boss wont be bursted with autoclicking math tactic with maybe 1 tactic. But its my feeling, maybe someone from other guilds can share here with his feelings.
Increase of def is not a good idea. That would change balancing between many classes. Only possible solution in my opinion is to increase HP, which can now exceed 2.147.483.647 HP native with 64bit client xd
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regarding latest notes
"Added entrance cooldown debuff to Jerath event in Realm of Forgotten Legends Hard Mode that lasts for 180 seconds. Jerath nows gains 8% physical attack everytime a player participates to the event, and gains 8% physical damage everytime selected player refuse to participate. Every creature killed will inflict 2% damage to tactic object."
I hope the group will not killed, if you only have 2 dps in group and both was in event room and have cooldown. That would be a very disappointing change, if we are forced to have more than 2 dps if we are only 6 ppl online
The change to the creatures is very good. Now the group can do something while 1 person is in event room 👍
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If my observations are different i should say why. I agree with you, that is why i propose go rofl together, then we can compare rogues + our gameplay. Maybe my feeligs are bad, maybe i have a right, maybe not. Connected run (Lutine, Nyex, Snickars, Merkur, Hanzou, Ramer) propaply will get solution this problem. In my opinion r/w and r/d are too strong, we can come on r/d (Merkur) and r/w (Hanzou, Ramer), you can come on r/p, r/wd, r/ch. If our point of view is bad then we are lost, but if we will do more dmg, then we will find op rogue. This idea is really interesting for me.
"Personally I have already tested all rogue combinations. Unfortunately, we don´t have many rogues in the guild that we cannot compare all combinations at the same time in one run."
So we can go together
I will not run random with any random tank I don't and cannot hold aggro, If one run is supposed to you for "the truth"
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https://gyazo.com/ac7b95e6bda627a320d504477ff725de
I was rogue/champ, snickars was rogue/warrior and nyex rogue/priest. 4 dps in group.
You need to reduce my damage by ~1,4kkk because I made b3. Rogue/champ is for me one of the best rogues
Kind regards
Thanks for that run! It shows not only that r/w is... like we said a little op relative to other combinations, but also r/ch is not bad. I wish it was a r/wd in party to compare
1.5.kk over mage and 1,6kk over r/p - it confirms our words.
And you proved that even on fast runs (like yours) where mobs/bosses are killed really fast - r/w is dealing too much.
Probably here will be also (if not i will upload it then) scruts from other raids on rofl to compare what is output in normal raids where mobs are not killed so fast. And there difference between r/w and r/p is more like 3.5kk...
Regards!
Don't see nyex as a good dps in my screen.... He had 2000-5000 ping whole time. Ty
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Mage/druid
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I have to say, then your rouges probalby dind´t play the other combinations right. No offense
And that´s just wrong. Just comparing different secondary combinations with one another does not help at all for the entire balancing. When do you only have dds with the same main class and different secondary classes? You should compare all classes with each other. Of course, the individual secondary classes must be balanced with each other, but also with other classes.
But to give you a proof we like to run with rogues tonight and will post the direct comparison here in the forum.
In my opinion balance should be first done in one class and it's different combos(so every combo of this call will be viable), and then level all classes to same/similar dmg(so everything will be playable). (but this is how i would do balance)
Ok so i wait to see what you guys will get with this run
i hope we all get some new experience and more usefull informations.https://gyazo.com/ac7b95e6bda627a320d504477ff725de
I was rogue/champ, snickars was rogue/warrior and nyex rogue/priest. 4 dps in group.
You need to reduce my damage by ~1,4kkk because I made b3. Rogue/champ is for me one of the best rogues
Kind regards