Class Balance [Patch 10.2.1.1000] & Bard

  • Couple things while testing ch/wl:


    Physchic Rampage (lev 70 elite) requires 10% mp on class that uses rage and focus - change to require rage or focus or none?


    Skill Indomitable Spirit (lev 35) says should restore 18.6% hp - it does not appear to restore any hp at all, please check - sorry did more testing, healing actually triggers when you do dark damage follow up, I guess works fine, apologies!


    Thank you!

  • Some thoughts on the latest patch regarding heals and wisdom:


    Wisdom is now incredibly overpowered on a healer, I'm doing 1.000.000 Recover's unbuffed with what really is mediocre gear, tier 12 gorge healing staff with max tier 9 equipment and 57k wisdom with whatever stats were available to me at the time.

    I LOVE the fact that wisdom is included in heal formulas, but these heals make my instance runs BEYOND boring.


    Buffing up wisdom gets me to pretty much 4.000.000 Recover on druid and 5.200.000 Group Heal on priest.. I really don't see how this is fun to anyone, healing is not a challenge anymore, the only thing I can do now to still have some fun is run instances unbuffed..

    One Mother Earth's Fountain or Group Heal and everyone gains 3 times their maximum HP, and Recover heals twice the tank's HP.


    I want to propose to reduce the amount that wisdom buffs burst heals (like the initial heal on Recover or Urgent Heal), and increase how much wisdom affects Heal over Time (like the effect on Recover on druid, or Regenerate on priest).


    This would make healing to me a lot more fun!


    Side note: This could also mean that people who had not statted wisdom before can still use their gear, because now their gear is beyond useless... I've seen the effects of it.

    Life is an enigma, and all we can do is our best to figure out what it means.

    • Official Post

    Thank you for your feedback, consider this as Beta as main thread mentions please, and about PvP, we will have different balancing for that content later.



    We are aware of some of these situations, as main thread mentions, this is Beta part of class balance and we will work constantly on further changes depending on your feedbacks and our observations, hence, we are expecting more feedbacks from community.


    Heal formula was using wrong modifier and it is changed after patch already, however, we will work on new heal formula even more within this and next week to balance it.




    Generally, as this is Beta, you can expect your class be stronger or weaker than current situation.


    Greetings

  • Regenerate is very good. This is a welcome change.

    But Urgant Heal is too weak. This is too frustrating.

    It only recovers 10% of that before 10.2.1.1000. (W/P)

    For W/P cuts own HP with Bloodlust, This is a matter of life and death.

    Fix it!

  • please look at the rogue class, it seems to me that it does not work correctly in terms of dexterity, I tested this class, so I first made the equipment in strength / strength, and then in dexterity / Dexterity and almost did not notice the difference. agility here gives almost nothing in this class. this class is also very poor in terms of survival in the new inst.

  • it seems that the new heal formula does not include wisdom in the correct way. According to my observations the healing of skills depends 95-99% on healing bonus of items. wisdom is more ignored than before, even for hots (healing over time)


    Also it seems that magical damage does not have any effect on healing skills

    Indeed there is something wrong with wisdom calculation, we will be looking for it.

    Thx for the fix. But now it seems, that only the "normal healing" is calculated with wisdom. Healing over time effects does not use wisdom properly in tests. Can you check it too?

  • Hello,


    My first impressions about the new changes are pretty good. I really like how fast you guys act when it comes to bugs and fixes!


    I found a little bug myself too, so ill share it here to get some attention about it. The skill from Mage/Scout Strength of Ashes (491576) - which you get when you summon your Flame Spirit (491577) doesnt disappear when you change ur class.

    https://gyazo.com/86dd5d10b76b970663ed14f9f4159130

    It would be great if you have a look at this, since this skill increases ur Magical Damage for 15%.


    Greets. :D

    Talking about peace whilst spilling blood, it’s something that only humans can do.

  • Mage/Rogue 15 min buff Shadow Protection, id 503274. This is supossed to reduce your aoe dmg taken, but it does the opossite, it increases the dmg you get from aoes :huh:

  • Hello,

    the calculation of the skill "Focus" is still wrong. Sometimes the extra physical attack get bonus from physical attack buffs like aged realgar wine and sometimes not.

    I could not figure out at what circumstances it is. Maybe you can check it? :)


    Kind regards

  • Now, there is one per day limit, at least Hall of the Demon Lord. I don't know if it is intended but I haven't readed in patch notes.


    EDIT: I'll rewrite better explained because I'm re-reading and says nothing.
    - We ran Hall of the Demon Lord (Normal) perfectly fine. OK

    - Disband and go automatically out of dungeon. OK

    - Want to go again and when trying to go inside an error message and can't enter.

    - We can't enter alone or in party.


    • Official Post

    It should be already fixed.

    Thank you for reporting it.

  • Hello,

    With this balance i dont know if you are thinking in change the scale of str in rogue and scout, cuse they are getting scale from dex and str while all the classes getting scale just from specific stat (champ/ warrior/warden str, mage/warlock int, healers wis), making those classes can use higer dex and str stats for they gears, making basicly the sta/dex useless stat and alowing the rogues and scout get more patack then other physic classes.

    this make they can playing whole the physical classes with the same gear, being unfair they can play classes should be using chain and they can do it with leather and still having good patack and now probably more easy they can be tank with the new shield form.

  • Leather classes like rogue and scout does not have more physical attack than class like warrior or champ. Why? Because champion and warrior are getting 2 physical attack per str point. (Warden only get 1,5 points. But wardens are imho very strong, especially the wd/warrior with his 2 physical attack buffs)

    Scouts and rogues become less than 1,5 points physical attack from str and dex. scouts for example are getting only 1,2 physical attack from 1 point dex. If this would be changed, that scouts/rogues does not get any physical attack from str, than the amount from dex should be increased. overall the rogues have the lowest physical attack with same gear of all classes, followed by the scout...


    And btw: as mdd, you can play every mdd class with just 1 gear (inclusive weapon) while pdds need for every class another weapon. And you can play for example rogue/warden with chain gear

  • Leather classes like rogue and scout does not have more physical attack than class like warrior or champ. Why? Because champion and warrior are getting 2 physical attack per str point. (Warden only get 1,5 points. But wardens are imho very strong, especially the wd/warrior with his 2 physical attack buffs)

    Scouts and rogues become less than 1,5 points physical attack from str and dex. scouts for example are getting only 1,2 physical attack from 1 point dex. If this would be changed, that scouts/rogues does not get any physical attack from str, than the amount from dex should be increased. overall the rogues have the lowest physical attack with same gear of all classes, followed by the scout...


    And btw: as mdd, you can play every mdd class with just 1 gear (inclusive weapon) while pdds need for every class another weapon. And you can play for example rogue/warden with chain gear

    The whole point of his suggestion is first, making deftness stat worth to use (now is useless while endurance and press are really good) and second, make leather dont needing pain so less fight for it. I agree, leather classes should increase dexterity to 2 points or whatever is needed to fit what they have now with str+dex.


    About all mdps using same stats well, mostly 2 kind of mdps vs 5 kind of pdps. Wouldnt be bad to have 2 mdps, 2 leathers and 3 chains with their own class related stat.


    Is just a suggestion.

  • Hello
    I don’t even know what to say, too many changes, I’ll write that my class is where I play or played
    The expansion of the backpack is just a wonderful change, thank you very much for that.
    But some add-ons will stop functioning correctly, for example, Extended Fusion, have not yet fixed the fSlimUI addon which changed the interface to a more acceptable one.


    rogue and scout
    You have not changed the parameters for calculating the physical attack dex and str,
    str should not give a physical attack like dex, make the calculation so that rogue and scout do not sharpen their equipment with dex and str.
    Scout and rogue should not claim 2 top stats in the dungeon immediately
    , rogue and scout should, like everyone, only sharpen their stats and nothing else, sharpening 3 str and 3 dex is a garbage option, this should not be.

    Champion/rogue

    You have weakened the champion too much, you took it from him. It’s one thing you took the Shield Form from him, you can still take it, but you took the Shadow Explosion from him and made him garbage, and turned one of the useful skills into garbage Kinetic Explosion, which enhances Imprisonment Pulse.

    It is impossible to leave everything as it is, you need to either return the Imprisonment Pulse or strengthen it and Kinetic Burn needs to be returned, maybe they can be stopped, but you can’t remove it.

    Perhaps it is worth reducing the consumption of rage from 15 to 5 for the Rune Overload skill, maybe some other changes.

    An attack on the area is the main thing the champion is useful for, and you completely deprived this class of this, let us then completely remove it from the game, once half done.


    This is only the first impression of the balance of classes, of course I can’t check everything so far I don’t have time, but I don’t think that I’m wrong because now the champion can’t attack well over the area and he has too little physical attack.

  • Dont missunderstand me. I agree with the idea of pushing patk from dex and make str/str useless for leather classes. But i wanted to mention, that atm leather class are very low at physical attack.


    Funny. We tested a lot and (i don't want to mention mdds... i hope some mdds will mention themselve, that their classes are too op) I must say: the champion is not useless atm. In our guild, the champion is still the top pdd, even in AOE fights.


    And btw: from me too - the class balancing patch is nice except some classes / calculations of some damage formulas ^^

  • And btw: as mdd, you can play every mdd class with just 1 gear (inclusive weapon) while pdds need for every class another weapon. And you can play for example rogue/warden with chain gear

    Yea maybe its because there are only two main mage classes for one the Mage itself and then there is the Warlock, also you can play several PDD classes with a single gear, for example Chain gear, I've seen a lot of people switching between Ch/R and Wd/W also you can even Tank with chain gear as a Champ, so I dont get ur statement u can also play several classes with the same weapon with CHain gear. Also with the new update a lot of mages had to pimp new items for example a dagger because of the new M/R variation, you dont just have to build a 2h Staff and can play every class ;) you also need to build more Items like the bow for M/S, the dagger for M/R a talisman for other mage classes, a Wand for W/M a Staff for all mage classes. Overall I think you have more options with a single Chain gear but thats just my opinion so I personally dont the problem right now ^^


    Update: Also if you want to play M/W you have to build a second gear to buff urself. No class needs to do that except M/W ;)


    Greets

    Talking about peace whilst spilling blood, it’s something that only humans can do.

  • Update: Also if you want to play M/W you have to build a second gear to buff urself. No class needs to do that except M/W ;)


    Greets

    But sadly the m/w elite doesnt stack with "Shetamb’s Think Tank" (which got nerfed from 20 to 10% mdmg btw) anymore and if your buffgear isnt that good its kind of pointless to use this elite skill at all because the set skill gives additional magic damage %. Thats why the elite skill "Wisdom and bravery" is atm useless because the set skill is better. It would be nice to know if there is a planned change for that ^^ (Maybe add the same magical damage % to it or lower the % even more on "wisdom and bravery" and make both usable again?^^)

  • Class balance is great since we have many choices now. But i dliske change what was made in healing :(. For now i will just write my suggestion/opinion on few classes.


    D/M

    Quick Help + Rock Protection - this regeneration its joke, change it

    Enhanced Body Vitalization - make it raid buff

    Summer Banquet - make it raid buff and since it's 5 min cooldown maybe can you increase a little receiving patt and matt

    Spring of Blessings - I suggest to change skill into some buff for 5 min at least. Since if someone want dot healing i think they would chose D/S instead.


    W/M

    What happened here? Compared to Wd/D white hits it's trash right now. (Test on CL Hard monsters with initially 700k matt & t14 gorge weapon, white hits 2 x ~400k [fire and wind damage], the same hits on training dummy). Something is wrong and should be repaired (or maybe i am doing something wrong?)


    Wd/D

    I really like these changes. But skills compared to white hits are nothing. Please consider about changing damage from skills since they low. (Test on CL Hard monsters with ~700k matt & t14 gorge weapon, white hits 5kk, charged chop ~800k)

  • Hello,


    I think that Wl/Ch have bug with elite skill [Saces' Impulse]. After Class Balance it skill increased effect duration to 300 seconds from 60 seconds. It give buff that must give Intelligence and recovery 4% HP (also bug with description) every second. But it not recovery HP one minute after skill used(screenshot 1). Also it continues recovery my HP for 1 minute if i cancel buff(screenshot 2). I think that it happens becouse HP recovery and Buff not connected.

  • R/Wrd 60 Elite has levels but doesnt scale anymore. It has static 6%HP heal and 20% dodge.


    Other than that i love how drastic these changes are. Will be trying all my old combos;)

  • Hello

    Please tell me it's a balance of classes or the murder war/mage and strengthening others? Lowered the attack by 30 % and did not strengthen any skill. No mass damage no passive damage increase. Return the magic attack or give something instead. Make Electrical Rage a passive skill to avoid making a stack every time.
    And fix the thorn shield of the druid/guardian .Healers interrupt each other's buffs.

  • First : Thanks for the fast change on the m/w i like it very much. ^^


    Overall i'm very happy with the new changes so far. So i wanted to share my experience here.


    The mage overall got a pretty nice buff and nearly every class combination is viable now (before only mage/warrior was viable in terms of dmg and m/wl for the supp)

    Now the mage is a strong single target dps class and especially burst dmg on some of the combos. In high inis the most classes are pretty viable and the lower the mdef gets the stronger the classes are (tikal for example it's pretty decent) except for the trash. In rofl for example the aoe dmg of the mage is pretty low compared to other classes (which is fine because of the single target dmg) except the /scout or /rogue but i'll mention that later.

    I like the change of the elemental dmg which gives all class combos a nice boost and you don't have to spam only "Flame" as every mage.

    Also that "Intensification" isn't useless anymore or skills like the "Meteor Shower" are useful now.

    The change of "Plasma Arrow" is very nice but it only lasts 5 seconds - that's why it's only worth for a 1x use for the burst except for mage/warlock because of the 18s crit buff and mage/champ for the additional damage on "Electrical Explosion".

    Another change is the chance of "Eruption" on a skill. My question is - is the damage intended that it deals now? Before it did the same damage as the cast and now if i cast a "Flame" with 12kk the "Eruption" only deals maybe 3kk? (Is this intended? ^^ )

    Additionally i wanted so say how nice it is that most buffs now last longer. Makes it very comfortable (and easy).


    To the sec classes (and their maybe intended main damage type? ^^ ) :


    /Scout (Fire/Wind)

    He got pretty nice dmg buffs and can push it's mdmg pretty high and you have the option of using the "Shot" for nice single target and especially trash dmg.

    Maybe a problem is the damage of the "Shot" atm. Your pet for example gives you stacks which increase your cast speed. This is not necessary because the "Shot" does more damage/is more viable than any other spell ("Flame" here) and the base dmg is very high.

    With my gear i can one shot first trash mobs in inferno for example but in rofl it can be compared to other classes in trash (below rofl its way stronger). He feels like a ranged warmage with higher base damage and stronger burst but way lower matk.

    Maybe the dmg with the skill "Shot" should be adjusted (for example decreased by 20% and then take a look how strong it is?)


    /Warlock (Fire/Wind)

    My favorite class even before (but not viable except for def reduce) and now too.

    "Fire Lightning Burst" Now has a 3s cast (which boosts the dmg very good) and the change of "Elements of Pride" to lower stacks and more viable buffs. (10% instead of 2% before balancing)

    He has pretty nice burst dmg and the changes (+nerfs) that were made today fit my opinion 1:1 - very nice changes. He doesn't have any matk push but reduces the def pretty good.

    Nice change that you can reset some cooldowns for a second burst and have a real "rotation" and not only spam "Flame" 100% of the time.


    /Druid (Earth)

    Pretty nice! Nice single target dmg and offburst but like most classes the aoe dmg is not that good. Additionally other classes increase earth dmg too now. (Also one of the classes that have a nice matk buff)

    Sadly atm the buff "Control Flame" doesn't work properly i guess - you can't recast a "Flame" to refresh the buff even after the buff ran out.

    Additionally the def reduce is very nice to have and makes it even more viable even if the dmg isn't the strongest compared to others.


    /Knight (Holy)

    Nice class, many pushes on holy dmg but it lacks of a real cast. You have decent buffs for holy dmg but only "Holy Light" is viable to spam. Maybe a change to 3s cast like other classes got would make him pretty nice. ^^


    /Champion (Wind)

    Nice dmg pushes and some new viable spells. Aoe dmg with "Ion storm" is okay i guess but the lowered cost makes it viable.

    The main damage spell is "Electric Explosion" with "only" a 2s cast that's why the hits are not that high and you don't have "Eruption" on it.

    Also a class where "Plasma Arrow" is viable to recast for the charged buff. Also a nice int buff for the matk.


    /Rogue (Dark)

    Oh boi.

    First of all very nice that "Cursed Fangs" (got nerfed by 30% which was a good change in my opinion) is now a 3s cast with dark damage. The buffs are pretty nice (cast speed, less dmg taken, damage)

    "Shadow of the Baron" gives nice stats like the 12% int and 15% aoe dmg but 50% more aggro which boost the aoe dmg (but also the aggro ^^ ) of this class. "Shadow Shroud" (which got nerfed by decreasing aoe % buff) gives a nice buff and has a pretty strong base dmg compared to the other aoes.

    "Gift of the Baron" also pushes permanently (if healed) the damage of the whole raid by 5% and heals them by 10% of your own hp. The range already got nerfed (good for me who pulls all mobs with 180 range :D ) to 80 range. The heal is too strong and it follow that the healers have less work to do. The damage is non existant but nice to have i guess.

    Also the "Purgatory Fire" hits double which boosts the aoe dmg overall pretty nice.


    /Warden (I hope Earth is intended but its fire atm)

    Pretty nice earth damage buffs like "Earth Scepter" which increases int and stam by 24% too or "Earth Marking" (crit dmg, earth dmg).

    "Absence" is also nice because of the earth damage buff. But i think another buff (but i don't know which one) stacks with it which makes it useless sometimes.

    My question to this class is - where is the earth damage used for? "Earth Surge" has pretty strong damage for an instant skill but it has 3s cd and has around the same dmg as "Flame" - that's why you only spam "Flame" at bosses atm. ^^

    "Earth Groaning Wind Blade" is a nice instant with 250 range and some earth damage. (But the damage is not really mentionable)

    Maybe if he would get an earth cast to use like most of the other classes it could be a pretty nice change. ^^

    And i don't know if you can proc "Eruption" while using "Earth Core Barrier".

    But this class is not a gatlin gun like it was before. :c


    /Warrior (Fire)

    I personally like the m/w pretty much and love to see that my suggestion was already implemented so my buffgear wouldn't be a total waste now^^

    He got the buffs from the main mage skills of course and his elite skills only got nerfed (which is kind of reasonable i guess :p) He's stronger than before but weaker compared to other mage classes.

    As before he has these high matk numbers (if you have a buffgear) which makes him more viable in rofl for example.


    /Priest (Water? actually Fire atm)

    Compared to others - very nice matk + buff for everyone. Higher chance for "Eruption" (which i mentioned above isn't very much) and a nice additional mdmg Buff.

    Overall pretty solid i guess but he has many elite skills for the cast "Rising Tide" from the priest. This was a water spell which got... completely dumped by "Rising Tide Mastery".

    Now it does fire damage (okay) but is an instant (way less dmg) and has a 4s cd. So it changed from a 2s spammable cast to an instant with very low dmg (which can get affected by "Eruption"! :P )

    Is there maybe a planned change for this? For example reverting this skill to a water damage cast with 2 or 3s cast could change this. :)


    - Set Skills


    Pretty nice to be able to have more slots and finally use all viable skills. :) (like it!)

    "Shetamb’s Think Tank" got nerfed from 20 to 10% mdmg but that wasn't mentioned in the patchnotes. But i guess the rest of the buffs can compensate that. ^^


    Additionally i can say some classes have damage or matk differences which makes a difference on the specific classes too.

    Overall (except 2-3) every sek class got some potential but of course there are still 2-3 top classes.

    I didn't mentioned everything for every class but if i missed something important or you have an other opinion let me know. I'd love to get some feedback on this. :)

    Also i haven't tested every class in every instance so my results can be different from their actual strenght.