Knight Class [Feedback]

    About Knight/Warrior


    Can you make United Efforts ( ID : 499930 ) a permament aura buff or 900 seconds buff ?

    And Quick Reflexes ( ID: 490064 ) could be a 900 second buff also.

    Maybe you should also reduce cooldown of Whirwind ( ID : 492356 )


    This class has very high aggro but its aoe skills have 6 second cooldown. It is too much i think

    Regarding Knight/Warden.

    This class is currently unable to compete with other dps classes, neither in an AoE nor a singletarget environment.

    I suggest the following:

    - Add to Earthly Devotion (lvl 15 elite): "Enables you to equip a shield with a twohanded weapon." This way the pdps worldboss shield would finally have its use and the class would get some much needed patk and damage boost.

    - Change Critical Matters (lvl 50 elite) to increase physical damage instead of crit dmg by 15%

    Regarding the new "Traces of the Cross Sword"


    I suggest that lower buffs (k/wrd dps for example) does not override the better buff from the real tank.

    Or only if you use plate, the shield buff should be activated


    Greetings

    Regarding this change:


    Reduced Traces of the Cross Sword cooldown to 10 seconds from 15, increased aggro multiplier to 2.5 from 1.1, increased radius to 100 from 75, removed target limit, increased stamina damage multiplier to 0.5 from 0.2, made it additionally inflict 150% main hand weapon DPS light damage every second for 12 seconds and upon initial cast, provide shield to raid members equal to 15% of your max. HP.


    first I thought it's not good as tank, to get the shield buff only if you hit a target successfully with the initial hit, but after testing several knight classes, I need to say that the skill is good as it is!!!


    Ty for this change. Even Knight/priest feels good now :O

    While I agree that the new ISS is great for tanking and makes Knight/Warden finally a bit more viable, I think Knight/Warlock is a bit too strong now.


    Suggestion:

    Knight/Warlock

    Reduced Two-Hand Weapon Mastery damage gain (1490501) from 109% to 90%.

    cannot agree. then you should nerf champ/scout and champ/mage in the first place.


    comparing with lot of other classes, k/wl is not too strong now. It has a strong AOE yes, but not the strongest. single target still worse than many other classes, but that's ok.


    P.S. and I tested it with a bit of mixed gear and mixed stats and with kinda pure chain gear

    PPS. right now k/wl is at the same pace liek some warriors (example w/wrd), mages (example m/r), rogues (example r/s) and warlocks (example wl/s)... these are not the only classes, just 1 example.

    I really don't get why k/wl should get a 21% overall nerf, while other classes do the same damage or more o.o


    I mean finally it's worth again to do some kind of mixed gear.

    You are free to have your opinion as I can have mine. But I think you are falling into what-about-ism a bit. Just because I think Knight/Warlock deserves a nerf does not mean your mentioned classes do not deserve a nerf. However, I am not Leather or Mage so I do not have the qualification to help balance those classes.


    Either way, from my experience, the new ISS added a significant amount of damage to Knight/Warlock. My suggestion aims to nerf overall dmg by 10% (209/190). I think you did a little misscalc with 109/90 to assume 21%.

    Quote from robopoke

    Either way, from my experience, the new ISS added a significant amount of damage to Knight/Warlock. My suggestion aims to nerf overall dmg by 10% (209/190).

    you know that those buffs works more than only the flat number shows.

    In my opinion and as far what I observed comparing to all other main-classes, lowering the dmg results in the same dmg like pre-ISS-patch.

    Every main class has minimum 1 class combination, that deals the same or even more dmg like k/wl. that's why I don't get your point. Would really like to see some sample scrutis, why you think in that way

    Two-Hand Weapon Mastery damage gain (1490501) is a simple damage-gain buff similiar to IBW and not like Warrior/Scout Blood Arrow which boosts physical damage. So the overall suggestion would still be just 10% (209/190).


    The new ISS easily added ~30% more overall damage. With my suggestion, Knight/Warlock would be still be stronger by around 18% (1.3/1.1).


    Scruts are mostly useless unfortunately, until Orkham is ran randomly. Even if I post scrut you can say that the other dps died alot or suck. Also devs said in the past, that their action is not based on few people, but the majority of players. This also explains why mdps are strong, because 80% of mdps are newbs (no offense, just low level guilds tend to play mage because support is bad)

    Quote from Byte
    Quote from robopoke

    If possible, can you explain the observations made to justify the decisions above? Are you using usage statistics. Are you analyzing average scruts? I am genuinely curious.

    As it is explained few times in past, if some class is too strong for you, it doesn't mean its as strong as it is to you for other raid setups. Analysis is done according to majority of end content (Dark Core) players and their instance attempts. Providing "balance" for every individual is impossible for us unless we create identical classes.


    Greetings

    Quote from robopoke

    Two-Hand Weapon Mastery damage gain (1490501) is a simple damage-gain buff similiar to IBW and not like Warrior/Scout Blood Arrow which boosts physical damage. So the overall suggestion would still be just 10% (209/190).


    The new ISS easily added ~30% more overall damage. With my suggestion, Knight/Warlock would be still be stronger by around 18% (1.3/1.1).

    and K/WL was crap before and made only 50-70% of the dmg of strong other dps classes... just my observations.


    Time to run constantly with this class and constantly fail that it gets not nerfed :D

    The statement is a statement but I doubt, that there are not any further statistics included, bcs mdps in general are not OP in my opinion


    but I will be quiet now...

    Quote

    Scruts are mostly useless unfortunately, until Orkham is ran randomly. Even if I post scrut you can say that the other dps died alot or suck. Also devs said in the past, that their action is not based on few people, but the majority of players. This also explains why mdps are strong, because 80% of mdps are newbs (no offense, just low level guilds tend to play mage because support is bad)

    The worst i ever read. Currently i dont see any way to balance anything.
    As a mage, i have to be lucky to be in a slow party to be top DPS, since i need some until myself get really strong. If i get a party with much chain dps or scouts, its almost impossible to deal quite decent dmg, becouse everything is down when i enter my real dmg skills rota. Ye, i can fix this. But then i miss support buffs i need or increase my dmg alot.
    Overall Orkham or any other Instance right now are just burst and be happy to finish orkham (highest ini) within 20-30min.
    You run, aswell as me, enough random to know what will happen there. Everyone will scrut push without thinking about what happen to pt. Thats how random works, like it is always.
    Anyway its impossible to balance properly. If you are first on mob, you are first in scruti with almost each class. We need some kind of harder, really harder stuff to see which classes are not balanced or balanced.
    And pls stop Mage flaming. After latest Patch mage is not that strong as it was like in the past.
    Just a little example for Orkham, a Knight/Wd or any other chain classes, uses 2 skills and get almost 1kkk dmg on 2nd event while me as mage or wl need to do full rotation to keep up. But guess what? Mobs already down until i can catch up. :)

    ~ Greetings

    In the past, there is an example of balance been unfortunately done by the opinion of only one guild e.g. LL. Scruts have been posted of a specific Warden/Rogue with great card-system (Patk is more op for Pets than for others) in Dark Core (high defense) who probably did not die (low aggro class, Heart of the Oak absorbing two hits) with probably active Warlock who placed Surge in a way that it hits the player and the pet in a party with probably consistent SA. Who knows, maybe the other dps are also bad. Tank pulling behaviour? A mystery. Result? Warden/Rogue got nerfed because of that one guilds experience. This experience was not reproduced in other guilds. In my opinion this is a disaster for healthy balancing.


    On the other hand, if this experience by LL would have been reproduced in random scruts consistently and by other Warden/Rogues as well, then of course a nerf is convincing and more justifiable.

    That is why I prefer to only use math as of right now to assist in my arguments for nerf/buff. If most people say that a ~30% dmgboost to Knight/Warlock is something the class desperately needed and is considered healthy then hey, no harm. More power to you.

    Quote from robopoke

    In the past, there is an example of balance been unfortunately done by the opinion of only one guild e.g. LL. Scruts have been posted of a specific Warden/Rogue with great card-system (Patk is more op for Pets than for others) in Dark Core (high defense) who probably did not die (low aggro class, Heart of the Oak absorbing two hits) with probably active Warlock who placed Surge in a way that it hits the player and the pet in a party with probably consistent SA. Who knows, maybe the other dps are also bad. Tank pulling behaviour? A mystery. Result? Warden/Rogue got nerfed because of that one guilds experience. This experience was not reproduced in other guilds. In my opinion this is a disaster for healthy balancing.


    On the other hand, if this experience by LL would have been reproduced in random scruts consistently and by other Warden/Rogues as well, then of course a nerf is convincing and more justifiable.

    That is why I prefer to only use math as of right now to assist in my arguments for nerf/buff. If most people say that a ~30% dmgboost to Knight/Warlock is something the class desperately needed and is considered healthy then hey, no harm. More power to you.

    uhm? hä?

    random runs = balancing groups? in random runs you have sooooo many supports, that some classes always overperform compared to groups without s/b, ch/d, w/p in group.


    and btw balancing should only be done comparing classes without dieing, bcs in 2024 no dps can die bcs of aggro, only bcs of bad playstyle, that is also often in random runs (in my experience, dps players always pulled mobs in DC random runs, why I quit tanking random)

    My point about dieing is that Warden/Rogue tends to die less often with same playstyle, compared to other classes because of its low aggro and Heart of the Oak which will positively affect scrut.


    I am getting slightly tired of this discussion. I hope we can focus on Knight again and agree to disagree with our offtopic opinions. But I think it is unfortunate overall for the server that you do not want to tank random, but of course your right to do so.

    Regarding latest patch:

    • Reduced Master of Darkness and Light effectiveness to 24% from 48%, removed duration and cooldown.

    I think that kills this class. loosing 24% physical dmg, dark damage and light damage from this buff is really heavy.

    Having this buff permanent doesn't matter. you don't fight 100% time in the instance


    why doing such a change? Oo I bet the class underperforms now everywhere and is the worst of all now :D

    Quote from Marcellos

    I agree 100%. At this point, this combination is simply no longer viable. To put it simply - it is dead.

    yes. instead of just reducing the dmg of the ISS, we slash with a giant hammer :D.

    I mean, nobody cared about that class before Traces of the Crosssword was changed. Why? Because it just wasn't top dps, just ok. So simple solution would be revert everything and just lower dmg of Crossword and increase aggro multiplier for the tank :/

    toxic :D bcs you need so much skill with this class xD and I compare the same players with a different class of sere. just saying xD


    Edit: Xaiza has better gear and knowledge than sere :P

    Quote from xLutinex


    but k/wl gets nerf xD

    how about some more details next time? I could also open a fake party and do some "extra dmg" and post it in here without context and say a class is overtuned.

    Did everyone burst? For me it seems only sere used a burst and the rest just crossed thumbs and watched him take off. If it was a "full-burst" scenario and everyone is equally geared I might worry for the rest of the party r/b never-ever does 9kk dps in full burst only... xD

    Maybe provide more information next time instead of just posting some screenshots and saying classes are overtuned or underperforming

    Talking about peace whilst spilling blood, it’s something that only humans can do.

    Yes sry. All fine with everything in last patch. I just didnt understand why some changes are made.

    After my guild mates clarified some things, I understand now every change and dont give any feedback anymore, because I dont Run random to compare.


    Farewell