Class Balance [Patch 10.2.1.1000] & Bard

    Quote from Madox

    Did anyone test druid/rogue since last changes? Would like to see some feedback. Thx.

    Imo this class is fine the way it is. Its not op like it was before and its not garbage. Its damage is great and with the right buff food and ur self buff, mana isn't really a problem so I think the way this class performs now is really good. You don't have your maximum damage every 1.5min but you still have a good off burst and if you have all of your buffs ready, this class still can do a lot of damage. Anyway, thats just what I think. Did you test it? Whats ur opinion?


    Greetings.

    It's time again for CoA - Chain of Arcadia

    Quote from Laisha
    Quote from Madox

    Did anyone test druid/rogue since last changes? Would like to see some feedback. Thx.

    Imo this class is fine the way it is. Its not op like it was before and its not garbage. Its damage is great and with the right buff food and ur self buff, mana isn't really a problem so I think the way this class performs now is really good. You don't have your maximum damage every 1.5min but you still have a good off burst and if you have all of your buffs ready, this class still can do a lot of damage. Anyway, thats just what I think. Did you test it? Whats ur opinion?


    Greetings.

    Thanks for answering :)

    For me is underperforming. This class aoe was never the brightest thing but it had incredibly easy and fast single dmg. Now the aoe is as bad or even worse than before (30 to 50% lower than any of my mdps) and the single can't make the difference anymore to reach the overal I get with others since is reduced in time and by around 20% less dmg full buffed. It breaks my heart but it joined the club of weakest classes ;(<3

    Quote from Madox
    Quote from Laisha

    Imo this class is fine the way it is. Its not op like it was before and its not garbage. Its damage is great and with the right buff food and ur self buff, mana isn't really a problem so I think the way this class performs now is really good. You don't have your maximum damage every 1.5min but you still have a good off burst and if you have all of your buffs ready, this class still can do a lot of damage. Anyway, thats just what I think. Did you test it? Whats ur opinion?


    Greetings.

    Thanks for answering :)

    For me is underperforming. This class aoe was never the brightest thing but it had incredibly easy and fast single dmg. Now the aoe is as bad or even worse than before (30 to 50% lower than any of my mdps) and the single can't make the difference anymore to reach the overal I get with others since is reduced in time and by around 20% less dmg full buffed. It breaks my heart but it joined the club of weakest classes ;(<3

    well i feel like d/r became slightly lower than average dps, yet i see it more like great supportive dd.
    d/r have acces to some nice druid set skills like combat rezz + trap clean, and also can provide great support in terms of resourse management of party members + perma crit buff + single target crit debuff.
    That's why i think even if his dmg isn't top tier yet this combo is still rlly good i terms of raid usefullness :D

    Quote
    • Fixed Imprisonment Pulse was inflicting damage to immune targets.

    Also a "Truth Shield Bash" of the Knight is dealing that damage.


    Edit: ah and if i remember well, Holy Seal dots can be also applied on the immune targets by using Holy Seal skill. Not sure if it also works with using Holy Strike.

    Regarding Scout/warrior and latest patch notes:


    Changed Autoshot to get affected by global cooldown considerably lesser, reduced maximum amount that can be shot in a second to 1.67 from 5.Why actually have Scout/warrior Target Lock? With lute, WL/M and any other additional attackspeed buff, you are a bit over 1 Autoshot each second. Don't know for what you now need the skill Target Lock except for wasting a global cooldown hmmm

    Hi,


    want to say, that for example rogue/warden is still weaker than classes like mage/scout and druid/warrior.

    You need way better gear, to do same damage. Mage/scout pet is doing really huge damage. If I substract the pet damage, mage/scout has nearly same damage like rogue/warden, but with worse gear oO.


    Only situation where the rogue is on top is single target full buffed. Sustained damage you totally loose against such classes like d/w and m/s. And r/wrd have perma Savage Power Oo


    Kind regards

    I tested more with partially using buffs. if you use Phantom Blade every 90 seconds along with only 1 other buff, you can catch up with other classes in AOE. Overall not soooo weak. ^^

    *Sorry for spam* xD


    I have a suggestion for the Druid skill Body Vitalization. Maybe it should increase the cast speed additionally, because there are now also classes which have CPS scaling? In this way, not only pdps classes benefit from this skill (for example if you build a group only with mdps, noone needs it ^^)

    Druid/Mage

    • Changed Holy Fury to do not apply cast speed to party members anymore; also modifies Mind Vitalization and when you use Mind Vitalization or Body Vitalization, it will also trigger other one.


    Bye bye support skill, maybe is time to make the class a proper dps? :P

    Quote from Madox

    Druid/Mage

    • Changed Holy Fury to do not apply cast speed to party members anymore; also modifies Mind Vitalization and when you use Mind Vitalization or Body Vitalization, it will also trigger other one.


    Bye bye support skill, maybe is time to make the class a proper dps? :P

    Why bye bye? I understand it, that you still buff the group with attack and cast speed at the same time. Only change is, that the cast speed is a separate buff now

    Quote from xLutinex

    Regarding Scout/warrior and latest patch notes:


    Changed Autoshot to get affected by global cooldown considerably lesser, reduced maximum amount that can be shot in a second to 1.67 from 5.Why actually have Scout/warrior Target Lock? With lute, WL/M and any other additional attackspeed buff, you are a bit over 1 Autoshot each second. Don't know for what you now need the skill Target Lock except for wasting a global cooldown hmmm

    It is already possible to trigger things on-hit with classes (like with the s/wl). They should just re-use the mechanic and apply x hits to one's autoshot during TF. The skill is useless right now.

    Quote from xLutinex
    Quote from Madox

    Druid/Mage

    • Changed Holy Fury to do not apply cast speed to party members anymore; also modifies Mind Vitalization and when you use Mind Vitalization or Body Vitalization, it will also trigger other one.


    Bye bye support skill, maybe is time to make the class a proper dps? :P

    Why bye bye? I understand it, that you still buff the group with attack and cast speed at the same time. Only change is, that the cast speed is a separate buff now

    Changed Holy Fury to do not apply cast speed to party members anymore; Hmm literally says is not group anymore?


    Byte appear and explain please. If is like Lutine says, please use better sentence is confusing as hell.

    • Official Post
    Quote from Madox
    Quote from xLutinex

    Why bye bye? I understand it, that you still buff the group with attack and cast speed at the same time. Only change is, that the cast speed is a separate buff now

    Changed Holy Fury to do not apply cast speed to party members anymore; Hmm literally says is not group anymore?


    Byte appear and explain please. If is like Lutine says, please use better sentence is confusing as hell.

    "Enhances your Body Vitalization and Mind Vitalization, they are now applying to all party members within range, lasts 20 seconds and using one of them will trigger other skill simultaneously."


    Change note will be changed for better clarification.


    Greetings

    Quote from Madox
    Quote from xLutinex

    Why bye bye? I understand it, that you still buff the group with attack and cast speed at the same time. Only change is, that the cast speed is a separate buff now

    Changed Holy Fury to do not apply cast speed to party members anymore; Hmm literally says is not group anymore?


    Byte appear and explain please. If is like Lutine says, please use better sentence is confusing as hell.

    You're just not reading the entire patch note.


    • Changed Holy Fury to do not apply cast speed to party members anymore; (SEMICOLON, MEANS THE SENTENCE ISN'T DONE.) also (synonyme in this scenario: simultaneously, at the same time, additionally) modifies (Here is the important part why this isn't a nerf!)

      Mind Vitalization and when you use Mind Vitalization or Body Vitalization, it will also trigger other one.


    Have a Blessed Day,
    Midan

    S/Wl


    Hi, I played the SWl now in a few rofl runs and think, the class needs another buff again. Compared to other magical classes, its damage is not relevant at all, compared to other dps in general even less. I requested a nerf recently (few patches ago), which would have been fine, if other classes had not been buffed decently in the same time. So now, after multiple meta shifts, the SWl feels useless again. Due to the non-existance of support (only for dark damage users), its damage should at least be equal to druid/rogue (which also isn't as strong as it should be atm).


    Please fix that - I personally think, its burst is way too less, since most of your spells trigger gcd, which interrupts both rota and autoshot. Since you're a caster, half of your spells are even interrupted by moving, additional GCDs are just annoying at all. Even with the latest Autoshot changes it feels not good.


    My suggestions:

    • Remove gcd from Reflected Shot
    • Remove gcd from Shot
    • Remove gcd from Vampire Arrows but give it a cast time of 1 second (like Piercing Arrows got it)
    • Remove gcd from Poisonous Snipe
    • Increase Poisonous Will poison damage gain to 25% from 18%

    I tested it too after the last change of this class and tbh, the burst is stronger than pdps scouts burst Oo. I mean, if I do nearly same burst (+- 5%) with my mage gear like my pdps scout, this class is definitly not weak in burst.

    And remove so many gcd will result in (let me count) 5 instant skills without a gcd OO. Don't you think this wouldn't be too strong with additionally increasing poison damage?

    • Reduced maximum macro wait duration to 60 seconds from 360.

    uhhmmmm....... How should I now use macros like Cape macro which needs 120 seconds wait to inform me, that my cape is ready again? Oo (No, I don't want my cape in action bar, because no slot for it!)What is the intention to reduce it so hard? What is the problem of 6 minutes? OoPlease answer

    Quote from xLutinex

    I tested it too after the last change of this class and tbh, the burst is stronger than pdps scouts burst Oo. I mean, if I do nearly same burst (+- 5%) with my mage gear like my pdps scout, this class is definitly not weak in burst.

    And remove so many gcd will result in (let me count) 5 instant skills without a gcd OO. Don't you think this wouldn't be too strong with additionally increasing poison damage?

    Well I see your fear, the skills w/o gcd seem to be a huge amount, but those skills make about 10% of the damage of the class. In AoE it's even less than 5-6% btw. So no, I don't think, it's too much. It would just be a slight buff, but the class would feel much better. Yes, burst is okay, but not enough to compensate its lesser sustain damage. The burst damage already falls down after about 10 seconds, while a mage/scout for example keeps up its fullburst for about 20-30 seconds. And M/S was already much stronger before the pet changes.

    Heyho,


    About the change of wl/r:


    "Increased Punishment damage to 6996 from 6360, changed it to gain 12% damage with every Elemental Weakness effect instead of 40%."


    It's true that the single target burst of this class is pretty good and needs a kind of nerf but i dont think that hard. Especially because it's the absolute main dmg skill and gets nerfed by over 50% in total when you have 4 or more debuffs.:(

    Also the aoe dmg of this class is far away from competing with other classes which compensates through the single target dmg.

    I'd suggest to start with around 30% at the beginning and look how it will perform after that.:)


    Greetings

    Quote from xLutinex

    Hi,


    want to say, that for example rogue/warden is still weaker than classes like mage/scout and druid/warrior.

    You need way better gear, to do same damage. Mage/scout pet is doing really huge damage. If I substract the pet damage, mage/scout has nearly same damage like rogue/warden, but with worse gear oO.

    A level 100 Belrog from a pdps player (rogue/warden) does similar damage compared to M/S pet.

    Quote from Zyrex

    My suggestions:

    • Remove gcd from Reflected Shot
    • Remove gcd from Shot
    • Remove gcd from Vampire Arrows but give it a cast time of 1 second (like Piercing Arrows got it)
    • Remove gcd from Poisonous Snipe
    • Increase Poisonous Will poison damage gain to 25% from 18%

    If you would have that many ngcd skills combined with scout burst you would oneshot everything <gorge.
    But yes i also tested S/Wl. Single target burst is ok, everything else other magical classes can do better. Its the only magical class which benefits from a tiered magical xbow instead of statted due to range weapon dmg increase from arrow of essence and devil's contract. This class does not have a discharge, lightning or silence like mages or a battle rez, weave curse or surge of awareness like warlocks. It isnt supportive at all, its a pure dps class and performs not good atm.


    I also think the nerf is to hard but i dont like the elemental debuff bonus anyway.
    Hughe ramp up time during trash and only strong when you stack enough debuffs (K/W, K/R or M/Wd) beside the normal m/wl buff. I would keep the planned 12% change so its more forgiving when you dont have time to stack debuffs during single target trashfights. But i would increase Shadow Slice dmg by 5% to 35%. Also Throw dmg is to low.. Its not worth at all. Its only a filler during offburst instead of being a core ngcd ability.

    hi


    byte, please give consideration to changing focus build up (wl/s) to some form of saces impulse where a warlock can recoup some hp we lose from blood arrow.

    focus build up to me doesn't serve a purpose since knowledge acquisition does a good enough job.

    thank you:)

    Quote from Byte
    Quote from Persil

    it's the absolute main dmg skill and gets nerfed by over 50% in total when you have 4 or more debuffs

    There are only 4 elemental weakness effects in the game those can be used simultanously, currently.

    This is 12%/24%/32%/38% reduction on single skill depending on elemental weakness effects the target has from 1 to 4.


    Greetings

    Heyho,


    I'm just a bit concerned about this class with this nerf (i just don't want the same thing what happened to the wl/ch^^) - The Single target burst is the main aspect of the class and Punishment does around 40-55% of a whole boss. Even with the 38% in total it's around 20% less overall dmg :S


    I mean we'll see how this class performs after that nerf and then it can be adjusted a little more.


    But why increasing the cd of End of ideas by 2 seconds? I don't think the 4 additional % will compensate these 2s.


    Greetings