I for one am happy about stuff you actively have to farm yourself. Buying in everything is lame. Maybe the Artefacts will be a little bit like Cenedrils: Parts are buyable, parts are only farmable.
Posts by MidanLauert
-
-
You really want to criticize my opinion, because I say "I / My opinion"? Nice job bro, nice bro.
It is ironic that you calculate everything to buy in AH instead of farm. That way, you don't need any diamond for stats and gear. Cool isn't it? Everyone can do that. An awesome fact! :O
Ah yes, the drones of new players going from below hos to rofl that are swarming the server and never buying anything. Awesome, didn't know they exist! Perfection!
We both know they don't exist.
-
nah fam. do that yourself.
In all seriousness though: my argument is an economical one. Healers with the same amount of investment as typical dps will have a lower return on investment than before, unless they are fully geared, fully statted - then it will be higher.Even a patk buff of 110k patk /matk for nowadays endgame dps, are quite even with the old 18% buff... now think about how much wisdom you need fullbuffed (pls don't try unbuffed xD)
I don't think that healers don't like the changes in general. Now back to topic in this thread
Endgame healers love the changes, no doubt. We're not talking about that. Those who arent statted as high have gotten a nerf - my heal gear for red rofl comes up to about ~130k. With that I'm giving out a buff of about 115k; That set cost a pretty penny (About 110k Diamonds), even though it is statted with mostly budget stats from before the change.
That's a price tag of, with a 200% promo, of 200€
The stats were more expensive than the one on my golden chain gear - which is 5/1, as was meta when it was built. But here is the thing: You like these changes, the break even to the old skill also depends on your class combination (surprise!) because they are great for the endgame - for the healers coming up it was a pretty drastic change. I personally like the change too, but I am also very aware of how these changes could frustrate newer players a lot. It forces progression upon healers, which is a good thing, but also made that progression harder, which is a bad thing. Healer items are additionally in shortage. If you don't give willing players a foot to stand on, how are they going to find their way into the game where they then come to a point where they become willing to pay that price? Answer: They aren't.
To make it more understandable what the issue is: Healers were a way for players into the game, a pretty good one, as healing was easy, didn't require much and brought good stuff to the table. Of course you do not feel this negative part of the chance: you already have everything, so obtaining it is not an issue. Obtaining that power becomes harder and harder with each change like that.The reason why original runes was such a success was because everyone could farm basically everything they wanted for gold. Sure, Diamonds were RMT only, but diasellers emerged as soon as level 50 (some even earlier). The barrier to start playing the game was set at "do you have a computer and at least one working hand" - which includes 99% of the population. Here, on the other hand, you turn level 104 in starter gear and you are too weak to heal/dps/tank even DL. They can do barely anything without paying - and healers were one of the few classes you could forcefully drag through the instances with some use. You are then asked to pay a minimum of 50€ to keep playing. The whole Kingdom Hearts Series costs 60€ on sale at the epic games store for PC, ESO (A direct competitor) costs 5 bucks + some DLC costs for the same amount of content, new MMOs come out regularly with a lower price tag.
How again is CoA supposed to compete with that when there is no way for players other than relying on the kindness of likely strangers to get over this barrier? And even then, it may take months for a player to then stand on their own - with healers it was different, and that has been taken away. If supports are changed similarly, I can guarantee you that even less players will try to get into the game. Anyone below the endgame was nerfed, period. The midgame barely exists anymore anyways, and this was another (annoying) slap to them.It's ironic how you yourself preach objectivity in your signature and argue every post with the most subject thing there is: an "I".
-
Display MoreDisplay More
Glad you asked! It's a more economical calculation than anything, but here we go:
Getting a healer with a red rofl item, let's say the body armour, one of the cheaper pieces, costs about 4.000 Diamonds - in addition, you need to stat.Arcadia Wisdom is about 500 Diamonds
Wis/Wis Tikal is about 1.5k,
Wis/Wis inferno is being sold for 3k,
Wis/Wis Gorge is about 4-5k,
Wis/Wis Rofl is about 1800 Diamonds.
Wis/Stam Rofl is about 500 Diamonds.
That makes about 500+1500+3000+5000+1800+500+4000 = 16.300 Diamonds.
A leather item is about 1.5k as a red rofl item
dex/dex rofl is 300 Diamonds
dex/dex gorge about 700
dex/dex inferno about 500
Str/Str Rofl is about 850 Diamonds
Gorge about 3.5-5k (prices are volatile)
inferno about 2k
That makes about 300+700+500+850+5000+2000+1500 = 10.850 Diamonds.
To reach the same values on your DPS as before, your healer has to spend 1,5023 or 150,23% of a leather gear wearer to gain the same amount of buff as before. Money which lower geared players simply do not have. The imerpative "I" in your statement shows a lack of how players actually grow up these days - you've been in the endgame too long.
For your rebuttal, I expect you to at least write a three page essay on comparative economics and cooperative capitalism. Be sure to include references from the list of approved sources (yes, I'm making fun of the way you assigned me a maths question. You ain't my professor. ;P)
Ok and now tell me, what do you think how high does the patt buff need to be to reach the same level as before and calculate which stats u need for that thanks.
nah fam. do that yourself.
In all seriousness though: my argument is an economical one. Healers with the same amount of investment as typical dps will have a lower return on investment than before, unless they are fully geared, fully statted - then it will be higher. -
It's the same issue as with the dreaded 30% nerf: It fucks over those that hadn't had the chance to build up harder than those who had. It disproportionately affects the starters.
Why? I already prefer flat values for patk buff. It is always better than %-patk., but for new healers in highend guild. But that shouldn't be a problem. New guilds doesn't have a negative effect.
Only the druid buff is lower than before, but the patk buff compensate it. please tell in detail why it should dispropertionately affects starters? And make sure in the calculation, that all players have same level and not 1 is full golden rofl, the other tikal statted.
Greetings
Glad you asked! It's a more economical calculation than anything, but here we go:
Getting a healer with a red rofl item, let's say the body armour, one of the cheaper pieces, costs about 4.000 Diamonds - in addition, you need to stat.Arcadia Wisdom is about 500 Diamonds
Wis/Wis Tikal is about 1.5k,
Wis/Wis inferno is being sold for 3k,
Wis/Wis Gorge is about 4-5k,
Wis/Wis Rofl is about 1800 Diamonds.
Wis/Stam Rofl is about 500 Diamonds.
That makes about 500+1500+3000+5000+1800+500+4000 = 16.300 Diamonds.
A leather item is about 1.5k as a red rofl item
dex/dex rofl is 300 Diamonds
dex/dex gorge about 700
dex/dex inferno about 500
Str/Str Rofl is about 850 Diamonds
Gorge about 3.5-5k (prices are volatile)
inferno about 2k
That makes about 300+700+500+850+5000+2000+1500 = 10.850 Diamonds.
To reach the same values on your DPS as before, your healer has to spend 1,5023 or 150,23% of a leather gear wearer to gain the same amount of buff as before. Money which lower geared players simply do not have. The imerpative "I" in your statement shows a lack of how players actually grow up these days - you've been in the endgame too long.
For your rebuttal, I expect you to at least write a three page essay on comparative economics and cooperative capitalism. Be sure to include references from the list of approved sources (yes, I'm making fun of the way you assigned me a maths question. You ain't my professor. ;P)
-
The change they made seems good to me, but it takes away the opportunity to appeal to healers with little knowledge or who are just starting out, I suppose that nobody will want to enter the game and spend 1k euros on the first day, they should review and do that be intermediate
same like dps? anyone were angry about new dps players doing low dmg? Why should ppl be angry about healer buffs? If a healer has low gear and the dps are angry, they should send all stats and clean stones to the healer
It's the same issue as with the dreaded 30% nerf: It fucks over those that hadn't had the chance to build up harder than those who had. It disproportionately affects the starters.
-
Yep! That's with all %-skills!
No, it is only with "dot" %-skills/effects, not with normal skills
Edit: I completely misunderstood. I thought he meant the mana recovery was reduced by the mana%. Mana-DoTs never worked, ye!
-
Healing Diamond Light % mana cost cant be reduced by magicial fruit pie
i tried it with the 85 iss from priest (20% mana cost), there the mana cost were reduced.
is it intented?
Yep! That's with all %-skills!
-
The question is though: how hard will r/p be impacted by the nerf? Will the mana-recovery being added to the class remedy this nerf? Will 10k per tick (50k in total) every two minutes suffice?
easy to answer: no
If mobs don't get a manapool ( I don't see any mana on mobs. Maybe they have hidden one), the r/p change will be useless i think. but we will see. Not many ppl playing r/p, but I play it from time to time, bcs I want to play rare classes. If mobs getting mana, that r/p can steal, maybe it is enough with e-potions
Afaik monsters have a hidden mana value, so long as the class they're based on is one that has mana. May have been changed on this server, but the mana stealing is additional to gaining your own % back. Perhaps d/s will be king of mana recovery then with the unchanged mana-ability.
-
Display More
You get CDR on this skill if you hit something. Bigger pulls reduce this to ~2-3 seconds cooldown, so your calculation is not saying very much. Especially considering that the base mana costs of the skills are massive already.
Not so enlightened Greetings,
Midanhow often do you have 12-13 mobs in rofl? We are talking about spamming AOE where, for example the r/p, it is also the MAIN dmg skill even with only 2 mobs there.
I would say you don't need to use your skill (and can't use) 600 times in 30 minutes. so your mana usage is way lower comparing with r/p, where you use literally 1500+ times a 5% mana skill.
And skills with 300, 600 or 1200 mana is not high base mana cost. You just need to adjust your character stats, that also as pdps you have 100k+ mana. 1k mana cost of a skill is 1% of 100k manapool.
Edit: so even with average of 5 mobs, you can only use your 5% skill every 10 seconds. Please don't compare with really big mana wasting classes
I agree in singular spamming scenarios, but you're literally chaining mana tags with the class, regardless of aoe or single target; Charged chop (336) or Wood Spirit (251), Thorny Strike (1276), Raging Strike (728).. Fullbuffed you come up to approx. 70k mana - so I'd argue that the mana consumption overall is pretty comparable. In addition: big pulls like that happen like 3-4 times in the run - so you're probably right.
Quote from xLutinexI would say you don't need to use your skill (and can't use) 600 times in 30 minutes. so your mana usage is way lower comparing with r/p, where you use literally 1500+ times a 5% mana skill.
Yeah, alright. That's busted mana costs
The question is though: how hard will r/p be impacted by the nerf? Will the mana-recovery being added to the class remedy this nerf? Will 10k per tick (50k in total) every two minutes suffice?
-
Really? I've played a ton of ch/wd which spams their skill (in trash), 5% each - mana hasn't been much of an issue, even without potting. Please enlighten me on those classes then, lol. I may be wrong.
Yes really. Play warrior/mage or rogue/priest. These classes have mana based spammable skills.
For those, who don't know the ch/wrd, the mana based 5% skill has 15 sec CD and is not spammable. In other words, you need ~ 0,33% mana per second, where other classes can use up to 5-6% per second.
Enlightened Greetings
You get CDR on this skill if you hit something. Bigger pulls reduce this to ~2-3 seconds cooldown, so your calculation is not saying very much. Especially considering that the base mana costs of the skills are massive already.
Not so enlightened Greetings,
Midan -
All the mana heavy pDPS do not come above 100k mana and magical dps do not throw their mana around nearly as much as other classes. This alone will keep the skill pretty relevant.
both statements are not correct. some pdps come above 100k mana and there are even mana based mdps classes, which need to spam percentage mana based skills to do dps.
Greetings
Really? I've played a ton of ch/wd which spams their skill (in trash), 5% each - mana hasn't been much of an issue, even without potting. Please enlighten me on those classes then, lol. I may be wrong.
-
In addition: I used my status as solohealing rofl in shit gear to demonstrate how stupidly easily healing is, not to put others down. There are much better healers than me. There are also worse. I do not mean to put anyone down, I am making a point on the fact that, as you said, there is no challenge for healers
The fact is you can skip inis by buffing your DPS and it’s the only reason you don’t have to heal so much. If you don’t want put anyone down just stop using passive-aggressive language like „adjust your playstyle” because who are you to judge ppls’ playstyle.
I could say worse DPS use kitty and worse healers spend more mana so does it mean kitty should be removed just like amount of mana for healers from Mana Retention?
I am literally not judging your playstyle, stop pretending I am. What I am doing is telling you that the nerf to the semi-afk priest playstyle is
- well deserved
- completely necessary
- not killing the class combination at all
as the combination of p/d was entirely too easy. It was a literal no brainer - now it's a no-brainer with a cost attached to it.
Without the, as you admit yourself, overpowered mana retention you'll run out of mana while spamming a 35% mana skill. Thats how it should be.
In all other cases you can still do as every other combination under the sun here has to: take a magical fruit paste and cut those 35% to 26,25% and all your other costs in the process too. If the costs are still too much, take a pot.
It'll still be the easiest healer, the average DPS will still feel the skill. All the mana heavy pDPS do not come above 100k mana and magical dps do not throw their mana around nearly as much as other classes. This alone will keep the skill pretty relevant.
-
Ok but still there is better solution to reduce mana support from p/d, Mana Retention could restore 10% mana per 2s for 10s and that’s it. 50% mana for everyone would be fair enough.
Pls stop telling ppl who is better or worse as long as kitty is available. And „adjust your playstyle” shows your lack of arguments in every discussion you use this sentence.
I think my sternliness is being misunderstood as hostility. It is not. I'm just presenting options on how to manage these issues coming up. This is why I tell others that they just need to adjust their playstyle. Adjust what you're doing and you'll see yourself having a lot more success. I do not see the issue and the issue won't come up for me again - I'll just take phirius potions if I need.
Your argument is literally "I don't want to use potions to sustain my mana" when that's exactly what they're targeting. Here's your challenge that you want: Managing your resources. It's the only challenge healers are presented with now. It's not the end all be all, but it's a good start.In addition: I used my status as solohealing rofl in shit gear to demonstrate how stupidly easily healing is, not to put others down. There are much better healers than me. There are also worse. I do not mean to put anyone down, I am making a point on the fact that, as you said, there is no challenge for healers.
-
You thought wrong. Heals have as much mana as a byproduct from wisdom.
Ah of course you think better. It's not like dps has everything in kitty right? And healers don't have to focus on 12 positions on addon. Are they? So huge amount of mana is not to help them focus only on healing and supporting. Now i get your point. 98 priest ISS is strong af so it deserves to cost 35% mana. Tell me where is the point of nerfing mana retention? To not use it?
PS: Healers heals the best if they use full potential of their class including 98 priest ISS.
I've played heal for a while now. Never had mana issues. You have options and healing is entirely too easy. I've healed rofl solo in t8, badly statted heal gear.
Yeah, healers heal better if they use all their options, but the ISS is just an excuse for laziness. Sucks lots of mana and heals just enough to be good.Using a heal addon makes healing insanely easy, to a point where most healers don't have their interface nearly as full - Come on. You gotta pot once every 30 seconds now or keep up magical paste every two minutes. It's not that hard. If anything, it evens the scale. I'm really, really happy with the changes. Adjust your playstyle. DPS do it once every week.
To your question: I figure the nerf to mana retention is there to reduce the amount of support these classes give. They're by far the easiest to play and have the strongest forms of support - something that cannot happen if you ever want to see any other class than that again. I see the logic: keep the heal unchanged so there is an easy class for newbies to pick up but remove much of the support so there is a way up.
The very best heals shouldn't be the easiest. -
Use a phirius pot... we dps do it too... If that isn't enough, use magical fruit paste - 25% less mana consumption
I thought healer has 1kk mana to not lose it as fast as dps.
You thought wrong. Heals have as much mana as a byproduct from wisdom. If you keep on spamming skills that take your mana like nothing good, yeah, no worries you're going oom. Priest heals better w/o the level 98 ISS anyway.
-
- Increased Mana Retention cooldown to 120 seconds from 60, changed MP recovery amount to 9980 fixed value from 473 heal power scaling value.
i dont know if this is a good idea
normal healers should have around 1kk mana so this skill would only provide 10% mana (10s x 10k fixed mana = 100k)
--> Every 2 min i get 10% of my mana???!!
Use a phirius pot... we dps do it too... If that isn't enough, use magical fruit paste - 25% less mana consumption
-
While this buff is active you'll also develop 3 stacks of camelia instantly.
Which buff? Only way to get instant 3 stacks is if someone is under 50% hp.
Oh, you're right, my bad!
-
Druid/Scout
- Changed Camellia Flower MP cost to 2% from 350.
Why not remove the need of stacking 3 times or the only 6 seconds HOT? I already have to use mana potion every 30s in world boss (in between of the class mana skill).
2% mana for a skill that we need to spam and that is there only for 6s HOT is crazy.
the first stack of the HoT is much, much more powerful than the added two, though... I can definitely see where they are coming from, especially since you could restore your own (and you allies) mana. While this buff is active you'll also develop 3 stacks of camelia instantly.
-
I'm not sure I like that druid/priest and priest/druid can buff dmg and attack. People will always want healers to play one of those 2 combos. Not a good thing imho.
About buffing depending on your wisdom, oh wow. We will see how that goes. Big change.
Scary changes but exciting at the same time 🤗
making it possible for players to play more out-there classes like wd/p or using a ch/d as secondary heal will be possible then! I am excited uwu
-
Display More
Wl/D
Kinda bad. The elite skills make it seem that the class is supposed to be a heal/support class played with mdps gear.
Its supportive skills are good because of its warlock nature but the heals are kinda lacking. And since you dont have any heal bonuses on an mdps gear some support skills like mindbarrier 497965 arent even fully usable. Maybe transfer some of the remaining matk to heal bonus or something.
However i am really not a heal main and would like to hear other peoples takes on the class. Right now the class feels very lacking. Not a true support and also not really a full heal or mdps either.
~regards Noodlez
Frankly, all the class needs for viability is to make the whispers BUFF raid wide. Right now only the heal is.
-
Thank you.
Although, I have just read through the whole description provided by the developer of the aforementioned add-on and I don't see that it provides that option..
It still just does it, though.
-
you miss something. Balancing means nearly equal dmg for all classes and not 5 op breaking classes. Bcs If classes are broken op, ppl will only play these classes and then we are back to gorge times.
The one-dimensional aspect, named damage, you propose being the axis with which balance is measured around leads to a variety of issues down the line:
1) How even do you measure damage on a broad, server wide scale? Damage is dependent on many conditions - gear, cards, cenedrils, ping, critluck, supports... This variable is incredibly unstable.
2) If damage is the only metric, how do support-capabilities fare into this? r/ch is arguably one of the stronger classes while also bringing quite the hefty buff to the party.
3) What about tankiness? Take HOTO for example: Champions are practicaly unable to die in there, thanks to their three defensive setskills and generally high defense even in demolishion-mode. Should they get nerfed over this?
4) What about difficulty of play? Again, some classes are much easier than others - why would anyone play a harder class without getting any benefit out of it?
Answer: Balancing is not just about creating equal damage for all classes, as then the meta will simply shift into more support-focussed folds. If those are evened out, players will gravitate towards the easier classes, as they are much more consistent to play. If that gets evened out, players will go for the safest classes.
Balancing could therefore be described as a plane on a graph; The axis have barriers to entry at which point a class will be viable for that role. The axis are damage, tankiness, utility and difficulty. The Integral of this function describes the class strength; the barrier to entry describe the roles a class can fill. If one attribute at one class spikes out too much in comparison to others, this class will be the new meta - no questions there.
This is a very mathematical view on the whole balancing debate, but the pure chase for damage has left meta classes to be uninspired, bland and basically the same. Boring. They are boring. Perhaps this is why many endgame players find the game a bit lackluster these days. Most classes play the same and you just choose the strongest class to run. Heck, even the warden, one of the most unique classes in concept has become bland as all hell, as now literally anyone and their grandma can run around with a pet.
And why nerf instead of Push: if you always push classes, you can solo dps everything soon without any supp in group and this will destroy group play, bcs ppl running with 4 ppl rofl instead of 10, if it's possible
Pretty much this. Nerfs are important, though buffing feels much better to the player.
To be perfectly candid, I think the methodology used to go about balancing wasn't/isn't the best in many ways; The frequency of balance changes is too low and the impact of these changes is too high. Slowly buffing/nerfing classes that need it, basically microadjusting them into the position they need to be is in my opinion a much better (although more time consuming) approach.
-
i like so much these "this class is to strong", "too much patt/matt" told by players (or by people looking on their dps) with t12/13 golden gear with XIII runes, t16/17 weapons and carts that give 20k patt/matt
and when i hear chemp strong...
me, chemp with my t10 golden gear with runes XI and t15 weapon on rofl doing 2/3 of r/ch DPS with similar gear...
I have t11 golden gear and some my runes are still t10 yet I find myself pulling even/being slightly below a similarily geared r/ch. If you'd like you could show me your kitty/rota and I'd be happy to assist you in finding the right rotation for you. Perhaps you alos have the wrong titles in your title system (e.g. eagle eye is in most places superior to lord of lightning for ch) or you're buffing wrong. Champions are much more complex than warriors, after all.
-
Hi. Would still like the ch/wd to get his guidance of nature gcd removed. Very clunky to use. Doens't feel good. Class is okay to play, but mediocore in comparison.
Thankies
