Class Balance [Patch 10.2.1.1000] & Bard

    Hi,


    1 hint. W/M is played with 2h. The auto attacks does not do the most damage anymore. Furthermore you need castspeed on this class instead of attack speed


    Greetings

    Well maybe it needs more testing but as you mentioned castspeed is important, so wand+tali allows you to have 2x curse XIII. Then i'm not sure about 2h being beter than 1h + tali

    You are correct, static field is pretty much the only reason mage classes are viable. If you "mega" nerf that skill we will be "mega" useless.


    "I'm waiting for m/p corrections, which has been forgotten a bit????" - I dont know what you are refering too? This class has a very powerful aoe in the form of Aquatic Storm and boosts its magic dmg by a lot. This makes you actually be able to compete at the actual bossfights. Furthermore this is one of the few mage combinations that is able to kill more than one organ in one go at Jerath, which is reeeeeally good for a mage class.

    -> it it is really good.


    I like the idea to give players an insentive to farm old instances again for new setskills. Sounds like a lot of fun to me.


    ~kind regards Noodlez

    During your burst you don't need the second Curse rune because your at 0.5 Castspeed anyway. And (in my case) since my 1h is 2 tiers higher than my 2h staff and even with the 2nd curse rune I loose damage. If there was a Talisman with elemental damage (*Wink* Worldboss?) maybe it would be better but since ur main damage skils deal wind damage, a fire talisman isn't really usefull.

    I tested the Warmage yesterday (and will today) and I was really surprised how well he performed :D Aoe damage wasn't as terrible as I remembered (it was pretty decent tbh) and burst and sustain were quite good.



    Edited because of brainlag :D

    Greetings.

    It's time again for CoA - Chain of Arcadia

    Edited once, last by Laisha ().

    Like 1
    Quote from Laisha
    Quote from deszcz2

    Well maybe it needs more testing but as you mentioned castspeed is important, so wand+tali allows you to have 2x curse XIII. Then i'm not sure about 2h being beter than 1h + tali

    During your burst you don't need the second Curse rune because your at 0.5 Castspeed anyway. And (in my case) since my 1h is 2 tiers higher than my 2h staff the curse rune doesn't even compensate the damage loss. If there was a Talisman with elemental damage (*Wink* Worldboss?) maybe it would be better but since ur main damage skils deal wind damage, a fire talisman isn't really usefull.

    I tested the Warmage yesterday (and will today) and I was really surprised how well he performed :D Aoe damage wasn't as terrible as I remembered (it was pretty decent tbh) and burst and sustain were quite good.


    Greetings.

    Wasn't w/m dmg formula simillar to s/wrl where (if i good remember and i'm not horribly wrong) even excessing castspeed cap was giving boost o skill dmg? Not sure in what patchnote it was mentioned but i remember something like that, but if not then ok.


    Greetings :D


    Edit.

    Found it: 10.4.0.2008 ((Cast per second skills (same mechanic used for Scout/Warlock elites) are considered as 3 seconds casting time skills which will gain damage until their imaginary cast time hits to 0.5 seconds limit.)

    so yea you don't get boost in dmg after you get to 0.5 cast speed for 3 sec cast, but as i know now it is like 84%? speed for 3s skill to be capped at 0.5. Then on w/m without skill like cathalysis i'm not sure if you reached this cap so easly :D

    You do, actually :D With your selfbuffes, buff food, SW titles and Guitarr you are at 0.5^^ If you only have STorm Assault and no Fire Training you're at 0.54 (if I remeber correctly, I'm too lazy to check atm)

    At least with golden gear which gives you 17% cast speed^^


    Greetings.

    It's time again for CoA - Chain of Arcadia

    Like 2

    Heyho,

    Quote from Noodlez

    You are correct, static field is pretty much the only reason mage classes are viable. If you "mega" nerf that skill we will be "mega" useless.

    i can agree with Noodlez

    This skill is the only reason some mage classes have potential. The normal aoe skills of the mage are very weak compared to the static field. It has a good dmg output but only hits 3 targets with a 20% decrement + you have to set it up with plasma arrow + gcd.

    Some classes are stronger with it because they can use it + their own additional aoe like m/wd, m/d.

    And the changes of thunderstorm are kinda... not relevant. The high decrement puts the aoe dmg after 6-7 mobs so low it doesnt matter and ofc the cd.

    Also "purgatory fire" is completely useless. NO one uses it (except for m/r). It's dmg is extremely low, only fire dmg, close range and % mana cost.


    Ont that

    Quote from Virek

    Talisman only amplifies fire damage, where on w/m fire damage is dealt by white attack and 1 skill. Everything else deals wind damage. Personally I would suggest changing the talisman ( that would be best) to give bonus to all element types,

    I think most people want this kind of change because the 1h wand is not as "useful" as 2h. But much more class combinations now need the 1h instead of 2h.

    But about making a new talisman with all elemental dmg -> the elemental dmg should be lower than the fire % of the aldo talisman. If it has the same or even higher % than the aldo talisman - the 2h staff will die on this patch. Around t13/14 on the talisman 1h would be as good as a 2h staff on the same tier BUT with an extra statted item (with insane non stats) and a second curse rune for offburst.


    Greetings

    Hi Arcadia,


    about Scout/Champ,


    I dont think Scout/ Champ should be a melee dps with Range 50,


    Please set the range 50 from „Gelenkschlag“ ID: 490420 and „Durchdringender Pfeil“ ID: 490400 to 230 like the other skills, this would be fine for this class, compared to other scout classes.


    Greetings :)


    Luciaa

    Quote from Persil
    Quote from Virek

    Talisman only amplifies fire damage, where on w/m fire damage is dealt by white attack and 1 skill. Everything else deals wind damage. Personally I would suggest changing the talisman ( that would be best) to give bonus to all element types,

    I think most people want this kind of change because the 1h wand is not as "useful" as 2h. But much more class combinations now need the 1h instead of 2h.

    But about making a new talisman with all elemental dmg -> the elemental dmg should be lower than the fire % of the aldo talisman. If it has the same or even higher % than the aldo talisman - the 2h staff will die on this patch. Around t13/14 on the talisman 1h would be as good as a 2h staff on the same tier BUT with an extra statted item (with insane non stats) and a second curse rune for offburst.

    100% agree! There are some classes that would benefit a lot from having a general % elemental boost talisman. There are so many things that boost elemental dmg that it could easily get out of hand and make 2h-Staff completely obsolete.


    So while it would be really awesome to have an all elemental boost talisman it cant be allowed to have the same or more %dmg increase than the aldo fire talisman. I cannot stress this enough!


    ~kind regards Noodlez

    Mage in general:


    Would it be possible to remove the gcd from "Elemental Weakness" (497977) and give it a cd (e.g. 30sec) instead. Right now, this skill is completly useless because you loose so much time and damage. Of course if you just remove the gcd this would be too strong, hence the cd. That way this skill would be good on bossfights but not spammable in trash.


    Greetings.

    It's time again for CoA - Chain of Arcadia

    Edited once, last by Laisha ().

    Like 9

    WlWd (tank)


    I got a (serious) suggestion for the WlWd tank that should make it more viable. Since WlK and DK are able to wear shields and physical defense is almost useless for the WlWd tank, maybe the Willpower Construct can be changed to enable wearing shields on that class, while active. But this would compensate the missing aggro bonus (which is necessary for sustain aggro) and an additional dmg reduction (and also stamina for more hp). The def isn't important at this point.

    Quote from Zyrex

    WlWd (tank)


    I got a (serious) suggestion for the WlWd tank that should make it more viable. Since WlK and DK are able to wear shields and physical defense is almost useless for the WlWd tank, maybe the Willpower Construct can be changed to enable wearing shields on that class, while active. But this would compensate the missing aggro bonus (which is necessary for sustain aggro) and an additional dmg reduction (and also stamina for more hp). The def isn't important at this point.

    You're talking about another 9% damage reduction and a literal fix to all issues here. Wouldn't that make the class a bit too broken? :D

    Quote from MidanLauert
    Quote from Zyrex

    WlWd (tank)


    I got a (serious) suggestion for the WlWd tank that should make it more viable. Since WlK and DK are able to wear shields and physical defense is almost useless for the WlWd tank, maybe the Willpower Construct can be changed to enable wearing shields on that class, while active. But this would compensate the missing aggro bonus (which is necessary for sustain aggro) and an additional dmg reduction (and also stamina for more hp). The def isn't important at this point.

    You're talking about another 9% damage reduction and a literal fix to all issues here. Wouldn't that make the class a bit too broken? :D

    Not really, the damage mitigation is already very high, so another 9% shouldnt matter that much, maybe it's another 1%. It's more about the bonus aggro through nonstat and stamina.


    Atm I got 48% through Stone Shell, 36.2% through Mind Barrier, 50% through Otherworldly Whisper and 6% through my jewelry set. This should be (correct me if I'm wrong) 84.4% damage reduction (without additional support).


    With the 9.6% of my t12 tank shield, that would result in a 85.9% reduction --> 1.5% increment.


    Also I'm having about 900k def in rofl all the time, so the additional def of the shield shouldn't matter too much. I mean, it's already working with 900k, so even more def shouldn't have such an impact on the difficulty.

    • Official Post
    Quote from Zyrex

    Not really, the damage mitigation is already very high, so another 9% shouldnt matter that much, maybe it's another 1%.

    This is correct if the goal is to find the increment on the reduction, but 9% reduction will reduce damage you receive at a certain moment by 9% regardless of your actual damage reduction. Therefore, it does not weaken the effect of percentual decrement while stacking.


    In your example, the increment of the reduction is 1.496%, but the actual damage reduction is still 9.6%.


    Greetings

    Yes, but the WlWd tank almost always has that much of damage reduction. At some point I don't use my Mind Barrier (while moving) or my Otherworldly Whisper (while AoE isn't useful). Then the additional reduction through the shield would be "higher" than 1.5% ofc, but it would still be far away from "too much" imo.

    I think the issue comes up with the fact that 1.5% sounds quite low, but you're not comparing "no reduction" vs "all + shield"; you're comparing "all" vs "all + shield" - which is a difference of the aforementioned 9,6%.
    It would turn a hit from 1.000.000 into 156.000 and from there into a 141.024 hit. That is no joke in terms of defense, especially if the goal is to just fix the aggro.


    The class, as it is currently, has aggro as basically the only issue. It brings more support and sustain than any other tank out there and it easily reaches the neccessary defense - while also dealing about twice the damage of a regular tank. Fixing that issue would make the class textbook overpowered. :/

    I would like to suggest that the developers implement a Test Server

    What characteristics should it have?

    1) All players can access.

    2) Use the Rofl npc to buy golden gear and weapons.

    3) Open that server only 2 days a week.

    4) Perfom all class balance on that server, and finally when it is finished, execute it on the official server.

    5) Stop class balancing and focus on creating a test server.

    This balance will not end if we continue on the same path, in the future we will have a SW patch and possibly a new instance. Let´s imagine the mess it would be if there is no Test Server to see these change before

    When there is a lot of confusion , people will not invest money and time in the game.

    These are just ideas, but i hope everyone can seriously collaborate with other ideas to make this Test Server and end with that class balance that has been present for more than a year. Sorry for my english and Thank you.

    My sugestion about W/Ch

    elite skill 35: Moon Cleave no need rage but consumes vitality points, after accurate hit increase bleed damage from slash for few sec.

    elite skill 60: -||-. If target have bleed, (slash bleed effect) shock strike deal additional damage.

    elite skill 70: Blood Whirlwind have eqeal bleed damage like bleed efect from slash.

    Quote from Vella

    My sugestion about W/Ch

    elite skill 35: Moon Cleave no need rage but consumes vitality points, after accurate hit increase bleed damage from slash for few sec.

    elite skill 60: -||-. If target have bleed, (slash bleed effect) shock strike deal additional damage.

    elite skill 70: Blood Whirlwind have eqeal bleed damage like bleed efect from slash.

    I am against such change. W/Ch is not weak and your suggestions would increase the AOE damage of the class to a level, that might be even higher than ch/m. This would only change the ch/m meta to w/ch meta. Better focus on classes, that can not compete with such classes

    Regarding R/Ch


    I thought a long time about this class. Need to say that in my opinion the change a few weeks/months ago, that "Electrocution" triggers a "Low Blow" if you have enough energy, results in a bit more burst damage, that you can nearly compete with other rogues (still a bit lower, but ok) but in sustain or aoe damage, you lack hard in comparison with for example r/w, r/d, r/p or r/wrd. Why? Because the energy consumption of Electrocution is heavy -> permanent out of energy. If you use other skills for single target hits like "Heavy Bash" or "Energy Influx Strike" you go fast out of rage (Electrocution only needs 10 rage).


    This class lacks a bit of things like r/d, r/wrd or r/p have -> non global cooldown skills

    Maybe change Heavy Bash on this class to be flawless and give it a chance to recover some rage or energy and cost 10 rage instead of 20? There could also be a reduce of the level 60 elite to 3% damage per stack to not overpower this class. But atm the playstyle is kinda "laggy" because of both resource problems


    Kind regards

    Quote from xLutinex
    Quote from Vella

    My sugestion about W/Ch

    elite skill 35: Moon Cleave no need rage but consumes vitality points, after accurate hit increase bleed damage from slash for few sec.

    elite skill 60: -||-. If target have bleed, (slash bleed effect) shock strike deal additional damage.

    elite skill 70: Blood Whirlwind have eqeal bleed damage like bleed efect from slash.

    I am against such change. W/Ch is not weak and your suggestions would increase the AOE damage of the class to a level, that might be even higher than ch/m. This would only change the ch/m meta to w/ch meta. Better focus on classes, that can not compete with such classes

    I agrree with Lutine. And about the rage issue, you have Dwarfen ale and the skill Enraged who give you rage back. But there is still another issue or a bug or wrong skill description with the setskill Crecent Moon cleave ID:490132 as I sayed weeks ago. The skill say you get immediately 50 rage and he reset Moon Cleave. The skill when used don’t give you anything of both if you don’t Hit even 1 Target. But get it’s cooldown of 10 sec.


    Best regards

    Quote from Vella

    My sugestion about W/Ch

    elite skill 35: Moon Cleave no need rage but consumes vitality points, after accurate hit increase bleed damage from slash for few sec.

    elite skill 60: -||-. If target have bleed, (slash bleed effect) shock strike deal additional damage.

    elite skill 70: Blood Whirlwind have eqeal bleed damage like bleed efect from slash.

    As others have already written, this would push the class over the edge in terms of damage.

    However, since the level 35 elite is outright useless atm, I partially agree with changing it too "Moon Cleave consumes Life instead of Rage." (10%). Keep in mind, without any added bleed.

    Solid suggestion in terms of convenience, but reducing the damage increment of the level 60 elite by a mere 1% is not enough to counteract the damage gain of a flawless Heavy Bash. It would be at least needed to be cut in half (2%).

    After all, R/Ch has lots of group support (lvl 15, lvl 20, lvl 45 elite) and shouldn't be as strong as other Rogues.

    Cutting lvl elite by half depends in change. If Heavy Bash is changed to be flawless without any other changes, you will be same like before without dwarven ale. The support of the class works only on static enemies (bosses). A change like for CH/m costing mana for Heavy Bash is not possible.

    Changing Heavy Bash to not cost any resource would be not in my mind, therefore the lvl elite needs to be cut by 75% or more.

    It depends on the devs ^^, but the main problem of this class is to be always out of both resources without dwarven ale. Other classes still have minimum 1 skill without resource cost or with resource you have infinitly (mana) like at CH/m, r/d, r/wrd or r/p.

    Even with r/w you have nearly no resource problems (except spamming whirlwind), because the class have a good rotation with rage and energy skills


    Edit: even with his own support IT is nowadays weaker at jerath event than r/p without any supp


    Kind regards

    Yes, I agree on that point. All classes should have a fluent rotation.

    Regarding the upcoming changes od Priest/scout.


    I generally like how you approach this class to be a viable dps. However, please reconsider the mana cost of the following:


    Quote

    Changed Enhanced Wave Armor to Absolute Zero; Increases your water damage by 40%. Cooldown: 90 seconds Cost: 50% MP

    Even with the necessary buff food to reduce mana cost...37,5% Mana for 40% Water damage.. You can shout for a mana buff even before you start bursting (especially in aoe-burst!) because you are imediatly oom (worse in aoe fights because you use 5% each cast). So maybe reduce the 50% MP cost.


    Greetings.

    It's time again for CoA - Chain of Arcadia

    Like 4