Tikal and Clops change

    Quote from Nadaná

    thats a pretty good idea and i would also suggest to remove the bosses and place some chests for all bosses with full loottable added, so you can choose one or two items from loottable, this would be a gamechanger. :whistling:



    #ofc i just followed the trolltrain in this thread


    All you're making is an extreme arbitrary suggestion that has no place in this thread. Help me understand your thought process. How do you go take a small suggestion about adding teleport crystals and place it in the same category of no bosses/free loot? How is that even a comparable point? *sigh* Let me quote myself and bold the point for you.


    Quote from Cloakshire

    It's not making the act of running the instance easier, but rather making the trek back easier if you happen to die.


    #Great bait mate, I rate 1 out of 8. If your going to troll, at least make it good :)

    What about someone close the Thread before it ends up in more senseless postings :thumbup:

    Never underestimate what you do for others.

    Things that seem small, even meaningless or pointless to you,

    might mean everything to the person you interact with.

    So troll in order to close thread is all you can think off?


    Hope someone removes trolling posts from otherwise good idea/topic.

    I'm gonna repeat myself but what the he.ll :)


    If You "happen to die" then improve Your gear or learn tactics so You won't die. This way You won't have to walk to the place where You died.
    Dying in ini has its consequences, one of them is that You have to walk, yes WALK back to the place You died. While walking You have some free minutes to think "what we did wrong? what do we have to change?"
    Please just start working hard for Your tikal gear like everybody else.


    I can see from here the future posts about Inferno that it's too long and You want to move it to WA zone xd


    btw, I like Nadana's idea, but I would modify it a little bit ;P After we kill Loki I want a chest, so I can pick 2 items I want and what stats are gonna be in those items :) It's annoying for us that for 3-4 days in a row we drop from Inferno stats like stam/dex or wis/wis or stam/wis that almost noone uses. If Disturbed wants to remove something that's annoying for them like walking I want something too. Because You know.. we all have jobs, work, family and want to remove repetition like Indis said :)
    Paragraph above was pure sarcasm ofc :rolleyes:


    I want my pink stam/int inferno stats, sigh :S

    Quote from Visenya

    If You "happen to die" then improve Your gear or learn tactics so You won't die. This way You won't have to walk to the place where You died.
    Dying in ini has its consequences, one of them is that You have to walk, yes WALK back to the place You died. While walking You have some free minutes to think "what we did wrong? what do we have to change?"
    Please just start working hard for Your tikal gear like everybody else.


    I can see from here the future posts about Inferno that it's too long and You want to move it to WA zone xd


    I'll bite. I'll omit your last paragraph since it was nothing but sarcasm and focus on your actual points.


    While I agree that having a few free minutes to reflect on your death is a good thing, doing so shouldn't take but less than a minute or two which is way less time you would spend walking back. I'm going to be honest here, but based your phrasing, you're giving me the impression that you don't want this implemented just because you didn't have this convenience initially. It's the whole argument of "I suffered through it, therefore those that come after me must suffer too." I'm not accusing your of having this mentality, but rather just stating the vibe I'm feeling from you.


    Think way to back when HoS/ZS/DL were end-game instances. Did having teleport crystals make the instance any easier to run than if they were never there? No, because having teleport crystals is nothing more than a convenience. It doesn't influence the difficulty of the instance at all. You say that we have to work hard like everyone else which I agree with, but where I disagree is when you associate running back as being part of the hard work. The hard work of an instance is in its bosses, mechanics, gear requirements, trash mobs, and execution of strategies. Adding in teleport crystals doesn't effect any of these so why are you making that correlation?


    Also, think back to when HoS and KBN's rez point used to be further away. After enough complaining, developers added a special revival point near HoS's entrance and right outside of KBN's. The people who suggested this were called lazy, and were given the same spiel that ya'll are giving Indis. But guess what? After the new rez points were implemented, the ones who were against the idea quickly changed their perspective when they experienced the change and realized it was a good idea. Will history repeat itself?


    Death is inevitable for people learning new instances or unfamiliar bosses. Practice makes perfect after all. Adding t-crystals inside dungeons would allow an inexperienced group more opportunities overall against the boss they're struggling with thus allowing them to perfect the fight quicker. Also, if single party member dies, being able to get back quicker reduces the amount of time that your party is going to spend waiting on you. How are these bad things?


    Your little remark about moving inferno bosses to a WA style instance is most likely a troll, but I'll use it to make one more point. We're not asking for the bosses to be lined up one after the other nor are we asking for the freedom to teleport to any boss we want. All we're asking is for a teleport system similar to HoS/ZS/DL. Say for example if I'm in Tikal, and I die at third boss. When I revive, I'll have to walk back to the instance, and once inside, use the teleport crystal. I won't end up at 3rd boss but rather the area right after 2nd. I'll then walk from the 2nd boss area back to the 3rd. This still gives me enough time to reflect on how I died seeing as I'm still walking for a bit. Again, how is this a bad thing?


    I'm going to ask you, as well as anyone else here to read my post carefully. Break it down, quote me, and reply to my points with logical rebuttals to back your points. I'm all for having an open discussion, but it's difficult to do when you have people assuming and spouting off accusations of laziness or trying to argue the point just because they didn't initially have the convenience. This causes the overall discussion to break down into senseless trolling which is nothing more than a childish tool used to distract us from an individual's half-assed point. Let's instead have an actual discussion where you try and bring your opponent to your side by outwitting them with points backed by sound logic. Or is that too hard?

    Edited 14 times, last by Cloakshire: Grammar, typos, reformatting, etc. ().

    Quote from Indis

    Would it be possible to have transport crystals in Tikal and Clops instance? (Like we have it in HOS)


    Also, it would be nice to have transport person, like we have @ Clops exit that transports you to instance start @ Tikal.


    I am sure we all would benefit in time if this would be added.


    For me, it's a good idea - save your time to make more runes and learn ( Some of the people speak as if it was kind of a simplification in killing bosses, I don't now why, troll ? )


    Not everyone must be pro ! not everyone has end-game gear !


    btw. someone who has never used crystal in HoS/ZS/DL, let the first throw a stone :)

    If someone doesn't understand something of the following wall of text, don't hesitate to ask me in this thread or via pm. I tried to make it as easy to understand as I can.


    tl;dr: you don't save time with port options after dying.



    Well, instead of only talking, I did some tests in Tikal(Raksha Temple) and HoS (normal).
    What did I do? I cleared the instance (thank you to the helpers in HoS) and then walked from the entrance to the last boss and took the time I needed for it.


    I did this twice for both instances. One time with movement title (sigil master) and one time with movement title and dn ring buff.


    The result I got:
    Tikal without dn ring: 3:46 min
    Tikal with dn ring: 2:43 min


    HoS without dn ring: 6:20 min
    HoS with dn ring: 4:44 min



    If you can port to the last boss in Tikal, after clearing the rest of the instance, can you just start the next try of the boss?
    No you can not.


    Why?
    Because you have to wait for the cooldowns of your skills. Since you died before it most probably means, that you need all your burst skills for the boss. So you have to wait 5 min before trying the boss again.


    Did you save time with a port?
    No you did not, because walking to the last boss still means that you have to wait for a while till you have all your skills rdy.


    If you have to wait anyways, why not just port and then wait, instead of walking and then waiting a bit?
    In my experience players tend to get bored more often, if they have nothing to do and are just waiting, resulting in them doing other stuff "fast" in between and coming back late. So in the end you loose time because you were waiting too long without doing anything (like walking to the boss).


    Now you may say, HoS got ports, why not in Tikal?
    Well, you have to look at the time, the instances were made. Back when HoS was new (easy and normal mode, not custom hard mode) the players did not have dn ring and I think they did not even have movement speed title. They did not even have kodex book to get back to the instance and they had to get to HoS from a spawn point somewhere in savage lands. So the port crystals really were helping the players to save some time.


    When Tikal was released, everyone could easily have at least one movement title and dn rings were also already common.

    Gjiara


    tl:dr: I agree that adding teleport crystals won't save time due to cooldowns. But still, we have people asking for it, so why not add them even it amounts to nothing more than a placebo effect?


    Firstly, thank you for taking the time to post an intellectual reply. Your post was well versed and I was pleased to see no sarcasm/trolling like some other posts here. Again, thank you.


    Secondly, after seeing the results of your testing, I cannot deny that you are right. Adding in teleport crystals won't make an instance run any faster due to the fact that upon failure, a party has to wait for their 5min cooldowns. I also agree that if players were given the option to teleport, there's a greater chance they'll end up idling in front of the boss for a few minutes before they can do anything.


    The main point of what you said is that adding crystals would be pointless because they won't make the run any faster, but despite this, there are still a few beneficial effects such as:

    • Allowing an individual that disconnects to get back with the group faster.
    • If someone joins the party after the run has already started, they can catch up to the party faster.


    Now, if I recall, you mentioned something earlier in this thread in relation to the first point...

    Quote from Gjiara

    Portals would only be a workaround for your problems.....and dc is something the devs can work on...


    I agree that t-crystals are just a band-aid, and the true solution would be the devs making it so players reconnect back inside of the instance. But if the devs added teleport crystals as a temporary solution while they worked on the dc issue, would you then be okay with it?

    you
    woke up after almost two years, why no one wrote about it now, so
    everybody can do this instances and now you wake up when the new
    instance comes out, show your strength and do not weep for such old
    instances